The Weekly DiScussion: Is stadium rock back?
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The Weekly DiScussion: the best festivals EVER
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Festivals eh? Remember when they were vaguely exciting? When you chose between the three or so that bookended your summer? Yes, it seems like a long time ago. These days, seemingly anyone can headline a festival. Even Los Campesinos!.
Essentially cheapened and devalued, there’s little kudos in topping a festival, even the bigger ones. How many people are going to wistfully look back at that Razorlight show topping off Reading in 2007? Or the Manic Street Preachers storming Glastonbury in 1999? Won’t happen.
The true test of a band’s size and impact now are stadium gigs; whereas the '90s and the first half of this decade have been dominated by bands topping festivals, it's now more about those bands who see little point in playing to other band’s crowds when they can fill a vast bowl of their own with their own devout followers. Because, if you’re paying £50 for a ticket, then surely you’re a big fan?
That is why, for the last couple of years, alongside the old school of Bon Jovi, The Rolling Stones etc, the new breed of stadium acts have marched forward to offer a new era of grandstanding shows. The benchmark was set last summer with a pair of Muse shows at Wembley, done in their own inimitably flamboyant style, while Arctic Monkeys have quickly moved away from playing other people’s shows to simply creating their own. Radiohead too, aside from an odd diversion into the land of V Festivals, have avoided all UK shindigs aside from Glastonbury (still seen to be in its own orbit around live music world) since 1996. Add to that list Kaiser Chiefs at Leeds’ Elland Road and, most recently, Foo Fighters, and 2008 seems a bigger deal for huge bands offering their own gigs than playing all the Readings and Leeds on offer. Certainly by Dave Grohl’s reaction on the final night of his two-evening Wembley stint, playing one of the most famous stadiums in the world was a much bigger deal than anything that had ever come before.
So why now? Aside from the aforementioned point that it’s almost too easy to find yourself topping a festival so quickly in your career these days, the rebuilding of Wembley seems like a key factor. The buzz around George Michael’s gig there last year being the first was huge and Muse’s show felt like a similarly big deal. The lack of the venue for most of this decade meant that the stadium acts had to play at Twickenham or the even-less illustrious Milton Keynes when they headed down south, and a newly-opened ‘home of legends’ appears to have added fresh excitement to a now long established touring circuit.
Video: Foo Fighters, ‘Rock And Roll’ with Led Zeppelin’s Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones
The other point, which is perhaps equally valid, is that it sorts out the men from the boys. Who really dares stake their reputation on the line and play the truly vast shows? Especially now that the norm is to perform a pair of shows; one’s now seen as a cop-out and really won’t do. While bands can be a big draw quickly, it seems to fill the likes of Wembley and Old Trafford you have to have some sort of established history and even sold – shock – some records too. Take note, Pigeon Detectives. I mean, Razorlight have been headlining Reading and V festivals for sometime, but do they have the guts to say they can shift 160,000 tickets over two nights in England’s capital? Ditto Kasabian and all those other huge ‘cult’ bands like Rage Against the Machine and Smashing Pumpkins who can take a quick pay-day in Berkshire at the end of August. Oh, and you’ve got to walk it like you can talk it too. If you can’t put on a brilliant, electrifying performance (that £500-per-night soundman isn’t going to help you in these places) then you’re quickly going to be found out. Have you ever been to a Bon Jovi stadium show? I have, and it was inevitably amazing. Same goes for U2, et cetera.
Video: U2 - ‘One’ live from Sao Paulo, Vertigo Tour
Of course, the daddy of stadium performances is still Springsteen – see the universally-acclaimed run of shows he played last month - but these mammoth venues are one of the few places in music where age and experience come before hype. It will be interesting to see who else attempts to step up to the big leagues in the coming years.
DiScuss: Are stadium shows now better value for money than festivals? Does it make it a better experience? Would you rather see Foo Fighters headlining Reading or doing their own jamboree? Who else might be treading the huge boards in the future?
Bon Jovi
Muse
Radiohead
U2
Foo Fighters
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Share on FacebookFestivals > Stadiums
By far.
I really dont think i'd enjoy seeing a band in a stadium, at all.
And the bands that do stadiums now, were much more exciting in smaller venues. For eg. Muse, Biffy Clyro.
Some of these stadium gigs
are basically one-day festivals though. So the value for money lies right there, in a one-day bill for £50-odd with six or seven similar bands you're more likely to like if you like the headliner.
Also, I won't wistfully look back on Razorlight at Reading last year, but I might feasibly look back on Blur, Pearl Jam, Metallica, Pumpkins or Maiden at Readings in the very recent past, or someone like Kiss or Priest at Download this year.
Oasis played Knebworth twice as well, so there's no distinct dividing line.
Is rocking a stadium the new festivals? Possibly, yeah. But only because there are now eighty-six zillion festivals, most of which vary very very little, and putting on an all-day stadium gig offers the 'fans' of that band a much better experience than waiting around for three days in a field in Berkshire - and is much cheaper.
Iron Maiden have a big stadium show coming up
and Metallica headlined Wembley lay year
Gigs with more than 2,000 capacity
are always shit.
UNDISPUTABLE FAKT
I might agree.
I saw U2 perform a couple years ago and it was worth it - simply a great show. I don't imagine they would get to perform stuff like that in a festival circuit. Also, it meant I saw Interpol play Hampden which was womething else.
if done right it can be great
the only problem is that most bands big enough to do these shows are pretty bland.
maiden + tallica and the like are really where its at, and the demand is clearly there. the maiden twickenham show sold out in a flash and tickets are going for £60 a pop on ebay
Stadiums
are for playing football or rugby in, not for gigs.
Just gigs?
Or festivals and stadium thingies too?
Cos I think I disagree.
I didn't think stadium rock
had ever gone away, certainly not for the 1 gig per year folk at any rate.
Bollocks.
:)
Just gigs
And football mathces.
I pretty much only see bands in seedy nightclubs
as God intended.
It started when you were born, and then continued
with a poor education and having far fingers.
But would you deny the brilliance
of seeing a band in a massive field, with sun going down, and everyone nicely happy and singing along at the tops of their voices?
Far fingers? Really?
Glad we cleared that one up.
Wem-ber-lee
Having been to the Muse gig last summer and the Foos this past weekend, I think you're right that playing the vast stadium gigs separates the men from the boys. I heard the Wembley Events Booker talking recently, and he said that there were probably only 40-50 bands in the world that could headline Wembley right now.
Festival performances are dependent on so many factors - the weather, who else is playing the same night, whether you're headlining the first night when people still have energy or the last night when they're all knackered. A stadium gig brings together fans of that specific group alone. No-one's going "back to the tent" to avoid a drop of rain. Most of those in the stadium will know the entire back catalogue. So the equation is probably something like:
Easier crowd to please
+
Big payday
+
Kudos that comes from playing such a legendary venue
Incidentally, I disagree with the comments about poor sound quality for the Foos gig... I think the acoustics in the new Wembley are second to none.
When have Biffy...
...headlined a stadium?
thomascraig you are ridiculous.
Are Kaiser Chiefs a stadium band?
I know they recently sold out Elland Road, but I thought that was just a one-off because it was a "home-coming" performance? Likewise with th'Arctic Monkeys? Anyone?
Can't comment on the Foos gig 'cos I wasn't there
but had no problem with the acoustic at Wembley for Muse at all either. I think like the article says, you've got to be right kind of band to be able to pull off a stadium performance, the line between a totally amazing stadium gig and an utterly utterly shit one is pretty fine, but its amazing it really is fantastic. Having said that festivals are still better because they're a bit more than just about the music aren't they. Re-creating a festival atmosphere in a multi-million pound grey bowl just can't be done..
..that is unless the Levellers headlined Wembley..
i look back to razorlight headlining leeds
it was fun
i think this
article has been a bit selective...
glasto this year isnt very helpful and there are certainly a fair few bands that have headlined festivals of recent that perhaps didnt have the clout to pull it off/deserve it.
but there were the chili peppers at reading/leeds last year. may have been an awful performance but definitely a stadium band who have played stadium shows consistantly since californication. Foos, U2 and Muse have all been doing it for the past few years quite regularly too.
Look at Reading this year... Perhaps The Killers are a weak link in back catalogues but Metallica and RATM reforming after 8 years is gonna be massive for a lot of people.
los campesinos! is in your fesstivalls
cheapening your headline slot
festivals still are exciting.
don't be a tool.
How much has this sight banged on about primavera/ Hove/ dour/ truck/ ATP's.....they are exciting because you get to see a range of bands. At UK festivals if you go go to see the main band it can be a disapointment because the 'big festivals' tend to have short set times, meaning bands cant do such a big show. However try an ER festival and you will find that most of them give longer set times, therefore the bands can give a better show, and will often bring more of a set etc.
Its two different experiences, stadium and festival.
For example, Id happily go to a festival to see REM. I tried to get tickets for albert hall and didnt. I didnt even consider going to see them in a stadium. I wouldnt go and see ANY of my heroes in a stadium in fact. The only band ive seen be trully amazing in a big venue like that was massive attack at the Birmingham NEC during mezzanine......and that was only good becaue the bass reverb was bone shuddering
i meant site.
my point, however , stands
also im sure the sign of an artists size and impact
are based on their ability to play stadiums.
I'll let Tom Waits know, shall I.
A trues sign is knowing of an acts popularity is when they know they can sell huge amounts of tickets and choose to do smaller shows, or just do impompu shows ( as i believe beck sometimes does)
sun and people happy !
Not my idea of a good time !
Psht
I'd rather see Los Campesinos! in a shitty tiny club than the fucking Foo Fighters in a stadium. By far.
i went to see
Bon Jovi (yes i know) the day after Primavera and its a totally different experience, the fist the air action to "Keep the faith" is just pure cheese. dunno about the status quo cover though. Mind you i did have row Z seats at the back of a stadium.
THAT SAID
Quite a nice article, writing wise. I disagree with it, violently, but it was a good read and a pretty bold move considering DiS's readership
i think..
Kaiser Chiefs are a stadium band because firstly there brilant live secondly there songs sound stadiumy (if that make any sceance)
40 - 50
I think even that is optimistic. Lets have a go at naming 50 bands (at this present time) who could headline Wembley. I'll start with the obvious:
Foo Fighters, Muse and something poppy like Take That. Maybe Green Day and The Who. Any more takers? Will there be a legitimate 50?
I've only seen one genuine stadium gig and that was Prince........
fair enough, it was brilliant and I'm glad I went, but I'm not sure it could ever compare to a half decent festival.
Rolling Stones surely
U2
Radiohead
Coldplay
Bruce Springsteen
George Michael (judging by last year)
Oasis (that wouldn't good, but they'd sell it out)
errmmm...how many's that?
I just
got back from Bon Jovi (no shame!) and it was a top show.
next two weeks I've got the radiohead london shows and springsteen in cardiff..if the acts can pull off the stadium show then its just as good as seeing bands in a smaller venue.
From seeing Radiohead play shepherds bush, compared to say either Earls Court or South Park, the latter were much more enjoyable experiences.
Tom Waits is different though
In that he has more of a dedicated fan base than the sort of mass appeal that other bands have mentioned here. Not denying his brilliance, but playing a big gig would be ridiculous because he can't eactly pull out a Born to Run or Hungry Heart out to raise the roof, so it's not so much choosing to play a smaller venue but common sense. Although that doesn't explain why he doesn't play more of them, but then if I was universally respected as Tom Waits, then I'd probabably do what the fuck I want, too.
Los Campesinos!
are headlining a festival in a railway shed that's smaller than Rock City. A bit irrelevant in a stadium rock discussion..
Wembley is a big place
And to be fair i was right at the back. And muse were still awesome when they were on a venue that big. But the sheer choice you get at a festival and the joviality between people and bands is what makes them special. You go to a festival just becaus its a festival at times, but you woldn't say that about going to a stadium show?
Oh and does the O2 arena count? Going to see Tina Turner there. Just wondered.
The only band to pull off a stadium performance to its full potential...
...is U2, for me anyway. Everyone else was a band in an air craft hanger, but U2 filled the fucker in every aspect.
Led Zeppelin
here's hoping!
No, it doesn't count
in my mind... you have to be able to see the sky above you.
though the refreshments at the 02 are stadium price, granted..
x
^ Wow
This is up there in my top 10 indie comments of the year!
what?
Yeah, It was a true show of a bands popularity headlining a festival in the 90's. Just look at Skunk anansie, The the, mercury rev ect. They could all sell out nights at wembley now
Bands that could possibly headline wembley
u2, Oasis, Kaiser chiefs(perhaps in like a year), Arctic monkeys, Metallica, Red hot chili peppers, Green day, Foo fighters, Muse, Bon jovi, Iron maiden, Paul mccartney, Bruce springsteen, David bowie, Ac/dc, george micheal, Take that, Rolling stones, Blur, the reformed guns n roses....... that's about it
Arctic Monkeys...
really?
The only 'stadium' bands I've seen that do it justice are
U2, Muse and Springsteen.
REM, Oasis, Chili Peppers, etc. play stadiums because there's enough demand for them to, but it doesn't seem to impact the show.
Festivals
offer a totally different live experience than a stadium concert.
Festivals are often more about the experience as a whole not just the bands, and i feel that the ones that focus soley on music such as Reading and V, fall short of being a festival and seem more like a 3 day concert any way.
Small gigs for the win
To each their own and all that, but for me the bigger the venue = the less memorable/special/fun/exciting the gig. I'm kind of appalled by these hugely expensive stadium shows, but I guess that they're just not for me, so you know... whatever.
Still, anyone who pays £40-50 for 70s punk reformations is a fucking cunt. ;)
And I wish I was going
But they were raised in the article so I thought it made sense. If not, ignore away.
Daaw
Oh, you.
small festivals are where it's at
I'm not a fan of big gigs at all. Any venue where you have to queue for more than 15 mins is a pain, and you just feel like part of a massive herd, tramping in the crushed plastic beer glasses.
What I do love is the new wave of smaller festivals, especially the fantastic ATP where you don't have to suffer a tent!
Some large venues do work - Brixton Academy - due to their design, but so many are bloody awful.
i've never been to a stadium rock gig
but have been to a festival. but i guess stadium rock will always be in and out of fashion, depends on the audience i guess, maybe....
guess you could say stadium rock are like flares.
stadium rock has never appealed to me either. i like to see the band a bit closer. music isnt about big pyrotechnics and "wow, how big is that stadium". i just like to watch my band and be entertained, which is the main reason why people go to a gig in the first place.
This is kind of bullshit
cos Id never go and see a band in a stadium, at least at a festival everyones spread out. In stadia everyone would be all up in your face
After seeing The White Stripes
at Nottingham Arena for £30ish a few years back, I swore never to go to an arena/stadium show ever, ever again. It's just not worth it.
Festivals I have no problem with.. at Primavera I got to see 90% of the bands I wanted from a pretty good vantage point, and the atmosphere compensates. But at arena/stadium shows, you're invariably surrounded by sociopathic cunts who don't often go to gigs and act like cunts.
have to echo the U2 comments
walked into the 2nd night of the manchester shows on the VERTIGO tour in a bad mood and liking maybe 5 songs tops. walked out mind-blown as a U2-live-show-evangelist. seems you have to have been playing stadiums for decades to 'work it' right.
It depends on the band
I saw Death Cab in Rock City and they underwhelmed me, wheras in a smaller club they are much better. Also not all bands can play arenas credibly. I think I'm happy seeing an older Classic Rock band in that environment cos they know how to project, wheras a lot of newer bands seem a bit lost to me.
I prefer small club gigs or festies really.
Possibly:
Prince
Bon Jovi
Metallica
Depeche Mode (poss not anymore, still do stadiums abroad)
Jay Z & Linkin Park (doing a joint gig at Milton Keynes Bowl, so...)
Queen
Kanye West (poss with good supports)
Eminem
Paul McCartney
In Photos: Arctic Monkeys @ Wembley Arena, London
In Photos: The Flaming Lips @ The Academy, Manchester
In Photos: Moby @ The Palace Theatre, London
In Photos: Tegan & Sara @ Shepherds Bush Empire, London
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