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DiS Missive: Can't we all just get along?



I don’t rise to bait especially easily, but earlier this month I very nearly snapped and tapped an e-mail the way of one of my peers. In its June issue Artrocker – a magazine with its place in the grand scheme of this industry we call our own – had published a bizarre attack on DiS. Without going into too many details, it was a woefully inaccurate critique, going so far as to deem DiS users “twats” and “lonely losers”, and suggesting we keep our business dealings with BSkyB on the quiet. This some months after a widely-circulated press release stating the company’s position and intentions ahead of the launch of our new sites. Maybe you’ve seen them? Guess Artrocker missed that particular memo.

Deep breath, and release: of course I didn’t send a missive the way of ‘Your Essential Indie Bible’ – which DiS is very grateful for receiving every month, as it gives us a good couple of days’ reading over our Sainsbury’s sandwiches and diet pop breaks – but even weeks later I’m still a little burnt by the seemingly unprovoked attack on a publication – that it’s online doesn’t especially factor into my consideration since I’m an old-school sort raised on inkies; I thought Web 2.0 was some secret mission on a Spider-Man console game until The Powers That Be set me straight – that I believe to be one of the best of its kind, written with a passion that infects everything from the smallest ‘zine to the glossiest monthly, but presented without barriers: you don’t like our opinion, brilliant, tell us yours. It’s simple democracy; where DiS trumps so many of its net-based competitors is with its community – these twats and losers – who can turn a negative review on its head in a matter of minutes. It’s a brilliant blessing and a frustrating curse at the same time, but an essential element of DiS that’ll never be ostracised from view.

My point here: we, the community, get along on DiS. We – you, more than us editorial sorts – bicker, bitch, argue the toss over the smallest records, debate the merits of bands only ever likely to sell out the back room of the Pig & Ferret or the Dog & Duck, or whatever. It’s a model that works; designs might come and go with the seasons, but this community remains. It’s not, or it’s very rarely, Us vs Them in a vicious manner. It’s something the wider industry should take a look at, because times, they’re changing.

Everyone who works within the music industry knows it’s a shrinking marketplace – albums don’t sell as many thousands as they did a decade ago, singles are disappearing from store shelves (Woolworths is the latest chain to announce it’s soon to cease stocking physical singles, offering downloads as an alternative; whether it’ll succeed at all considering iTunes’ grip on the market remains to be seen), and venues are threatened with closure. The knock-on effect is that labels see their staff numbers cut – witness recent developments at EMI, where up to 2,000 individuals were told they would lose their jobs in January – and magazines (and websites for that matter) bend over backwards to present content New and Exclusive, Hot and Fresh, Thrilling and Exciting, et cetera. Of course it rarely is – Artrocker is nobody I know’s essential indie bible – but a stand must be made. Voices must be heard. But whose?

Artrocker’s heart is completely in the right place – it’s a shop window for breaking-through bands who can’t yet fit into the NME equation, let alone Q or Mojo. It might not always state its aims in the most favourable language, seemingly preferring to adopt a backs-to-the-wall Us vs Them mentality, but I understand this angle: it’s how I used to feel, years ago, starting out.

Yet when I was a little younger I read everything, never sticking to one option over another; NME, Melody Maker, Select, Q… hell, I even bought Vox from time to time, and picked up Kerrang! when I could. So that ‘I hate the NME’ attitude that weirdly rose up from my gut, around the time I was careering about Soho listening to Glassjaw’s first album on a near-daily basis, soon dissipated. I realised that I wouldn’t have half the breadth of musical knowledge, and appreciation, without the influence of all of those magazines, each of which had different agendas but made their arguments clear. They might have been competitors, but there seemed to be a sense of harmony – it was rare, as I recall, to read of one trashing another.

Which leads me to a simple conclusion: really, can’t we all just get along, guys? There’s a place for everything that’s held dear in this industry; it’ll continue to downsize but great music will always out, and it’ll forever need a conduit of sorts to carry the message of its excellence to those not in our very fortunate positions, where any album can be ours in a day or two, songs can be assessed months ahead of release, and ticket stubs are the things of misty nostalgia, crumpled paper in sweaty pockets replaced by ink-stained hands and tattered wristbands.

I’m in the habit of forgiving, forgetting, apologising, amending. When it’s the appropriate course of action. I’m not asking Artrocker to say sorry for badmouthing DiS – they’re as welcome to their opinion of this site as our readers and users are theirs on DiS’s own reviews and features – but it would be nice, soon, to see a sort of unity amongst the smaller voices in the industry. (DiS is the biggest site of its kind in Europe, but our reach and reputation counts for only so much when proverbial dinosaurs still operate the industry’s most significant levers and pulleys.) We do all have something worthwhile to say, but if we’re shouting over each other all the time, it’s just a cacophony of meaningless noise that no bands will benefit from. Put Blood Red Shoes on your cover, brilliant; we put out a single of theirs, remember? We’re singing from the same sheet, sharing the same clothes, sleeping with the same people. We’re practically married.

Let’s try to make it last, eh?

I've always found DiS to have better articles

artrocker seemed to be a bit london-cliquey, but I haven't read it for years.

Can I still hate the NME?

You are all sleeping with BRS !

"published a bizarre attack on DiS."

To be fair, you have slagged of Artrocker several times on the msgboards.

nope

we can't.

"its June issue"

But it's online as well surely?

HOW CAN THINGS NOT BE ON THE INTERNET??

"Lonely losers"

Probably not that far off the mark no?

I like Artrocker sometimes

but they seem a bit moody... a bit like a teenager of the music press... bless um.

Yes.

yeah I think we quite often

admit to that on a daily bassis on the social board.

artrocker

is fucking shit.

Artrocker

Hmmm...having met some of these characters and shared living quarters with them last summer, I can only say that any attack on DiS is simply a case of pot calling kettle...

artrocker

had a picture of me on their website and as such can be accurately accused of having no clue :)

ps. i like artrocker.

losers... yes.

lonely... sometimes I wish...

Could Artrocker publish a sentence this long?

"Deep breath, and release: of course I didn’t send a missive the way of ‘Your Essential Indie Bible’ – which DiS is very grateful for receiving every month, as it gives us a good couple of days’ reading over our Sainsbury’s sandwiches and diet pop breaks – but even weeks later I’m still a little burnt by the seemingly unprovoked attack on a publication – that it’s online doesn’t especially factor into my consideration since I’m an old-school sort raised on inkies; I thought Web 2.0 was some secret mission on a Spider-Man console game until The Powers That Be set me straight – that I believe to be one of the best of its kind, written with a passion that infects everything from the smallest ‘zine to the glossiest monthly, but presented without barriers: you don’t like our opinion, brilliant, tell us yours."

One colon, one semi colon, four hyphens and some italics. Stick that up your indie-bible pipe!

PS - I've never read Artrocker, it sounds twatty.

I know.

I'm fucking brilliant, me.

i'd be surprised if they could spell kettle

and not them claim it to be a next best thing kinda band who has released one seven inch and then split up without evening playing an opening slot at the buffalo bar.

i've met several idiots from artrocker, including one of their editors who seem rather put out not to be invited to be on a panel at great escape alongside dis, nme, rocksound and kerrang. i'm constantly stunned, that much like Organ, despite having so much passion for music, their paranoid, verging on delusional (when it's legible and/or coherent), political assertions are quite so incredulous.

http://siteanalytics.compete.com/artrocker.com+drownedinsound.com/?metric=uv

this is the same artrocker

who turned down a band i was releasing singles for for a show, saying 'you have no idea the music we put on', and then went on to make it single of the week the very week the band were on tour?

Or the same artrocker who turned up half an hour after doors at a show they were promoting, and then tried to pay another band £10 instead of the guaranteed £50. (said band were from overseas, and what they tried to pay didnt even cover the bands food....) pillocks.

I missed that panel.

Who won?

Question

Does Tom Artrocker still edit, hey, Artrocker? Does he still write editorials about how he, as a white male, doesn't get all the opportunities that asylum seekers get in the UK? Or did he graduate to the Daily Express?

An honorable sentiment.

And one I do try to maintain myself for quite a while, writing for both DiS and Artrocker, amongst others...

... but Mike, really. You've never said a bad word about other publications? Maybe not in print, m'dear, but your claws are just as sharp.

Music has always been tribal, and it always will be. The bitching is never gonna stop.

I've criticised many a publication, and band, and festival, etc etc

But I've always got my facts straight. Opinion is fine, so long as your accusations are founded on a definite truth.

I'm gonna bite my lip here.

Coz I know your heart's in the right place on this one.

I try to read everything

but have never read artrocker (or even heard of it. Must take my head out of my arse more often). I find the reviews/replies by DiSers much more useful than any 5/10 'official' review. And in fact I probably only read reviews to reinforce my own view of a band.

:o)

x

i was once

number 3 in their playlist.

ps. i like the english language

Top keywords

driving web traffic according to Site Analytics:

Artrocker = "peanut smugglers pictures"

DiS = Wear a motorhead t shirt", "death cab for cutie i will possess your heart rapidshare" and "big tits"

I like Artrocker

cos they liked my old band and I enjoyed reading Delia Dansette's stuff.

I haven't read it for a while.

I also like Mike Diver. Cos he wiped his hands on his jeans before shaking my hand at The Great Escape. Now, that is the sign of a true gentleman.

depends

where his hands had just been.

Or..

his jeans.

I disagree with you

The writing in Plan B is pretty well researched ad knowledgable on the whole and the general structure of it seems slighty less trad than the well-beaten (and somewhat tiresome) track of 'what's hot, what's not'. Maybe it's just me, but i prefer to read music journalism that sort of invites you over the threshold casually and offers you tea, biscuits and a 2-way conversation rather than it forcing a double vodka into your hand, throwing a flailing arm over your unsuspecting shoulder and then shouting 'THIS IS IT!' into your face. Artrocker represents the latter, whereas I find DiS and Plan B provide the untimately more satisfying former. Sometimes i like a vodka, but more often than not, i find more enjoyment to be had with tea.

.

The main problem with Plan B is that is a group of dull writers covering a bunch of dull bands, and hoping that some form of magical alchemy will lead to this making interesting reading. Surprisingly it doesn't.

he's like the indie rock

marcel proust, dunking his metaphorical berocca opinion into the veritable tea of controversy.

i'll stop now.

^

wrong!

yeah

but this one in particular seemed a bit, i dunno, rushed, a bit childish even, like he got back from the pub after a few beers to find someone on the DiS boards had called his mum a slag and he wanted to get a retort in five minutes before they went to print. there are plenty of ways he could have legitimately had a pop at this site and music sites in general without invoking the old "all internet users are geeks" stereotype.

The print media is on the decline

nobody reads newspapers of any kind, anymore. They're the new millenium's horse 'n buggy. I'm sad to see them go...and I understand print media's frustration...and "sad and loney" doesn't just apply to us...but 10 years from now it'll be NME(dot)com and DiS who rule UK music press, if not already.

All media will have to join the internet revolution or cease to exist. So if Artrocker is determined to take an Us vs. Them stand they're destined to a defeat. If they wish to wave their flag claiming theirs is a "glorious" defeat, then so effing what.

Oh. And DiS writers>>Artrocker writers.

I dunno how John Brainlove fits into the above equation, but he should re-join the winning team, aye.

DiS writers >> Artrocker writers

Maybe that's because most DiS writers tend to write about stuff they actually like rather than what they're told they're supposed to like.

i think its the opposite

dis isn't afraid to have a go at sacred cows sometimes, whereas artrocker seems a bit student press; people just review stuff they love...
at least thats how it was last time i looked.

^

!!!!

Yeah there's that as well

The point I was making was that Artrocker and its writers tend to focus more on "scene" bands regardless of the quality of their music. I did a piece for them once, and they were more concerned about me getting pictures of "cool looking people" in the venue than the actual written piece itself, which sums it up really. For me anyhow.

^ This guy's website ^

Rules.

Pussies.

Have a fight.

Yeah

who'd have thunk it?

I've never read the print edition Artrocker...

But I can safely say that their website is fucking shite. The figures above ^^ don't surprise me in the slightest.

Larrikin Love

Nottingham Cabaret 28th February 2006. Remember it well. Still got the note from the editor too complaining that the people in the accompanying photos with the review didn't look cool enough. PM me if you wish to see it Mr/Mrs/Ms Tartrocker.

i got sacked

well - made redundant ....from artrocker...felt kinda bad to be the most sackable writer for artrocker! argh!
i like reading what people write on these forums - unless they're just plugging/street teaming/bassists boyfriend/girlfriend loving up out of loyalty. I don't like it when threads vanish cos they go against the advertising policies of a site...
Delia

Artrocker...

...has gone downhill recently - the whole step to monthly was a bad plan.

In all, they have got rid of some of the fun writers, delia (^^^), art-hip-rock-hop or whatever it was, that stuff from LA etc

This has been replaced by huge numbers of (sometimes) worthy new artist highlights; artistically the whole thing is almost unreadable with the backgrounds they choose; and can you have more in your face 'branding' - the whole thing is taken over by CONVERSE JD and RED STRIPE!

Once upon a time, I would look forward to my regular two weekly supplement, a group of interesting bands on the covers, insightful single reviews that was just enough to keep me through to the next little chunk.

Now it is so bloated that half of the reviews have no relation to the actual single; live reviews are patchy; and the covered bands are ooold news.

Sorry Artrocker; I no longer love you :(

and

the cds used to be good too

Plan B

I live in Australia (shipping costs!) and Plan B is It for me - the one mag I buy. Their interview of a given artist is always the most enlightening (unless Everett, whom I love, does it on an off day eg recent Breeders) and I feel I can trust the recommendations of particular writers. Their longer reviews have personality without the usual ego overload found elsewhere. It hasn't maintained the dizzying highs of its first issues (and Careless Talk), particularly in the short form reviews. It continues, unlike most mags, to justify having an actual physical magazine instead of a website.

So, while we're on the topic: when's MissAMP going to write for The Quietus as promised?

bskyb

WUT??

There's a lot of love in the world...

....group cyber hug anyone?

^sad and lonely

...nope...

.. just a little randy.

Artrocker

seems slightly ropey and reminds me of the sort of 'scene' stuff I don't really like, but fair enough to them for getting their own magazine off the ground. Some of the writing and overall content on this site can be a bit dodgy, but a lot of it is good and the community aspect seems unprecedented.

Ultimately though, in terms of editorial quality - Pitchfork is many leagues above both publications.

nothing against you richard...

xx Delia xx

I don't see the point in this article

other than a convoluted way of bigging up DiS and stating how much of a better position it is in compared with other sites of similar ilk.

Music is a subjective artform, so it is folly to suggest everyone will get along, no matter waht the ultimate aim is.

Also, the sly Glassjaw reference was a bit unnecessary, did that matter to the article or was it just to make yourslef look cool?

Robert Murdoch is taking over as editor.....

expect a forthcoming DiSBand feature on 30 Odd Foot of Grunts.

: (

Yeah,

the hostile rantings of a Ting-Tings fan too.

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