The Tuesday DiScussion: can we beat festival crime?
It’s no secret that things have a habit of going missing at festivals all the time: from stray cans of Stella and portable gas hobs to leather jackets and digital cameras, each and every major music festival campsite suffers a rash of robberies once inebriated metalheads have retired to their inflatable beds and roll mats. Just because it’s an apparent given that possessions will find their way into new hands over a bank holiday weekend, though, doesn’t mean we have to take it. Something needs to be done, surely: as the yearly festival season becomes ever-more clogged with two- and three-day benders in cities, suburbs and the countryside alike, stories of mid-slumber raids and returns to camp to find rucksacks spilled and valuables stolen will become more frequent than ever before. It’s time suggestions were sought, advice offered and brainstorming begun. So, this Tuesday’s DiScussion is intended to get this particular ball proverbially rolling…
Perhaps you’ve read that DiS’s coverage of this years’ Reading Festival has been crippled, rather, by the theft of our photographer’s equipment – click here if you’ve not. Quite obviously, this isn’t on, and the comments under the original article suggest that Ben Jones, the victim in question, is far from unique: many of you have seen possessions disappear at festivals, and some 260 crimes were reported at Reading alone this year (as of Sunday morning). So what can be done, if anything?
Should security be upped? Should organisers cut a few hundred VIPs from the guestlist to pay for additional bodies to monitor the campsites those same freeloaders never go near? More eyes the better, surely? Or would an increased security presence detract from the authentic festival experience, if such a thing truly exists anymore? Would wandering watchers bulky of build and short on tolerance stamp down on kids just cutting loose while their parents’ backs are turned? Would it be possible to properly police campsites without such a measure leading to drug- and alcohol-related arrests?
Would complete CCTV monitoring ensure that any thieves were caught in the act, or would that again infringe upon the enjoyment of attendees? Should the entrances to campsites be more secure? After all, while it’s difficult to get into the arena at a festival like Reading without the right wristband, it’s a doddle creeping into to camping areas.
What about some kind of locker system? Would it be possible to provide lockers – accessible to all and available for no additional charge – where valuables could be stored when not needed? While a wallet’s necessary throughout the day, a camera may not be. Likewise iPods or any sort of stereo equipment. Do certain festivals already provide lockers? I can't immediately think of one, at least not one where such a facility is made obvious.
Is such crime just a symptom of the success of certain festivals? It’s interesting to note that few thefts occur at The Truck Festival, but that many do at larger events – is this simply because of the number of attendees, or does Reading’s audience differ so much from that of Truck that a criminal element will always be present? Are line-ups ever to blame? Does the booking of particular acts attract a certain type of gig-goer who might fill their free time by looting vacated tents? I’ve been to a good few All Tomorrow’s Parties weekends, and never witnessed or personally experienced any crime, of any nature. Yet my tent has been rummaged through while I’ve been at Reading, and friends have suffered thefts (and assaults, for that matter).
Basically, what can be done to ensure that festival goers come away from such events happier than when they arrived? Nothing sours three days in a field more than losing something as essential as a mobile telephone or – even worse, really – extra clothing, coats, boots or bedding. It’s gutting to return to your tent after witnessing a great set from your favourite band only to find the zip open and your underwear and train tickets scattered all over the grass, and this that or the other stolen. Gutting. But what can be implemented to cut the ever-growing level of crime at festivals?
DiScuss…
Also, check this out - Love Not Riots - and learn to love the Sunday night at Reading and Leeds, instead of using it to trash toilets and burn stuff next year.
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....the average festival go-er (journos/cameramen aside) should be looking after their own stuff. What do you need at festivals? A camera, a phone, a wallet and what else? All of that can be stored on your person. Please point me in the opposite direction of the festival that beefs up security to protect feckless Jeremy/Jemima's mp3 player/digital camcorder/virbrating rabbit/air conditioning unit. Festivals, they're becoming more and more like corporate Boy Scout camps. Can we have badges for attendance next year mother superior?
I've been to Reading Festival
twice, and never had anything stolen, but I'm not sure whether I would want to go back again. I went in 2003, had a good time, but it was tarnished by two things. Early Saturday morning some git decided to walk over our tent with us still asleep in it. We spent most of Saturday morning fixing the thing (poles snapped, not good). Then, Saturday night I think it was, I was punched in the face and head a couple of times (for no reason, totally unprovoked attack, possibly because I was alone) by some people as I was walking back from a friend’s tent. What made it worse, was I had been attacked outside my own house 5 weeks before I went to Reading, so it shook me up quite a bit. I was not sorry when we left early Monday morning to go home.
That's an interesting point
you raise about the line-up.
Bands like The Streets, Arctic Monkeys and Dizzy Rascal were being watched by masses of scum. There was also obviously a lot of nice people there, so you can't really blame the organisers.
The locker thing would be a good idea, if you were prepared to wait in a queue to get to them. However, the campsites should be manned I think. They should have guards out there camping with the rest of the people. We pay £150 to watch a bunch of 'pretty good' bands. The least we can expect is adequate security. Going to a music festival shouldn't have to be a worry.
There should be a number to dial if you have any trouble, to which some guards can come and give you a hand. The punishments should be harsher - complete life-long exclusion from all festivals and prosecution for theft. The rules shouldn't change for festivals. Also, if the guard presence seems to piss people off, they'd have to live with it. I'd rather be secure than feel 'free' or whatever.
If I go to Leeds again, I won't take my digital camera like I did last time. My phone and wallet stayed stuck to my legs. Skinny jeans help this, because you can feel anything at all below your waiste.
As for people coming into your tent at night, again, you'd need actual security to stop it happening. Blokes, and even kids like myself having to stand up to thieves is gonna be daunting in itself, so think how it would be if a couple of girls were camping together: pretty much defenceless. I was shitting myself when my tent got broken into. I almost resorted to pretending I had a knife that I was going to use on the guy. Lol, instead, I just made my Northern accent sound more predominant and raised my voice at him. It didn't work.
It sounds terrible but you could see people just taking the 'You take the risk of this when you come to a festival', but you shouldn't have to. I don't know about others, but I went to Leeds in hope of getting away from the cess pool that is my home town. I wanted to spend a weekend watching some bands around people like me. 90% of the public are scum / idiots. It seems like 50% of the people at Leeds are too. Its a shame.
you could
take the broader view that crime, especially robbery and burglary, is an indication of the growing gap between rich and poor and the impossible levels of aspiration expected of modern brits.
That this leads to the kind of resentment that makes oiks feel justified in robbing "those loaded middle-class wankers doing drugs in a field" is unfortunately hardly surprising.
it's not about festival security; it's about social cohesion...
or yeah, y'know, we could all party in alcatraz and carefully log everything we take in and out of the festival (my, those queues would be fun) and stop doing illegal drugs because of the CCTV everywhere - but that doesn't sound very pleasant...
glastonbury and green man provide secure lock-up points.
those are the only i can think of though..
increased security
doesnt really help, its outsourced isn't it? and a few of them sell drugs as an extra earner. Just because there are more people wearing orange jackets doesnt make it any safer.
I say dont camp, or dont go and go to foreign festivals instead and up and coming ones. (like truck and latitude)
....
...at least it will keep the plebs out with their shite taste in music. I hate them plebs, coming over here, shagging our beer....
smaller festivals
also had thefts: Quite a few robberies at latitude.
Its a regular thing apparently: look at this article here: http://www.efestivals.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=67851
Increased Security = Not A Good Idea
I feel a lot of sympathy towards the cameraman for having his stuff pinched, but it would also dpeend on how secure he was keeping his stuff. Obviously taking his equipment is a prerequisite of the job, so a very difficult situation. I would be very wary about bringing valuables to Reading, and when I slept at night in my tent I kept my wallet and phone in my jeans pockets.
The security I encountered at Reading seemed to be the normal groups of skinhead tossers to be honest, and the problem is if anything did get nicked I'm not sure what the nicest security people in the world could do about it anyway. The police presence did seem non existent (although there was a temproary station) and more police would sadly lead to more drugs-related arrests.
To be honest in Yellow Camp where I was the atmosphere did seem fairly peaceful and friendly and even on the last night when I visited Green it was more everyone enjoying themselves in just a very loud way. I don't think I saw any fights or stuff.
i think the mistake here
is assuming that theres actually a major problem. 260 crimes spread over three days at a festival with a capacity of 80,000 people really isnt that many at all; it think its actually less than the national rate...
ultimately, its a really fucking big campsite which is quite empty for most of the day; theres a limit to how secure it can possibly be; how would more security help? how would they know whether or not the person getting the really expensive camera out of a tent is the owner of it or not?
frankly, i dont see what could ever be done to improve the situation (leeds and reading already have left luggage areas, even if they seem to be very underused), but neither do i think the situation is at all bad; festival crime sucks a lot, but ultimately it isnt very widespread.
in my opinion
Lockers seem to be the only real solution here. That and additional security info sent out with tickets advising ppl not to bring valuables to a festival. I'm sure we can all live without our ipods and portable stereo for the weekend. It seems obvious but these things still go missing.
One tip is to dig a little hole in the ground before you put up your tent. You then stick your valuables in there when you go into the arena, and roll the grass back over it.
Another thing is that when I was at Glastonbury a few years back there were a large group of Welsh ticket touts camped nearby who methodically went through every single tent in the field, even nicking my friend's trainers when he was asleep in his tent! It took a 17 yr old girl armed with a knife to get that and her "motherfucking" vodka back. But yeah, basically, there are ppl who go purely to harvest whatever they can lay their hands on.
thats
a good point.The only people who know who is in which tent is perhaps the one or 2 tents surrounding them. And like someone said if they get caught going into someones tent at night they just say 'sorry wrong tent' and im sure that that must happen occasionally.
I was
pickpocketed during Hot Chip on Sunday night at Reading, someone stole my wallet literally right out my pocket. So thats 261 crimes.
I think the ultimate and only surefire way of avoiding festival crime is to not take anything valuable with you.
My camp came under attack
From some scumbags from South Wales.
I wasn't there but the story goes that . ..these wankers were calling my mates all emo cunts (if you check my bands; I am anything but). Er, no we're not, fuck off. Then they started throwing stuff and later started beating up a couple of our mates - shoving baseball bats in their mouth and just being thugs etc. When my pals came back they started smashing beer cans over these cunts' heads and it turned into a bit of a riot. The police came. The cunts then threatened us again with baseball bats. They got their wristbands cut off and they left the site. We thought they were going to come back on Sunday night and kick us in but they didn't. Well done PC Plod, eh?
This was all in Yellow camp on Friday night.
As for festival crime. There's no way to stop it. It is too tempting for the average criminal. You'd need a major upgrade of security.
God that does sound bad
Where were you in Yellow? I was about a third of the way up Y2 Road from the arena .
260 reported crimes
there may have been 300, 400, 500...much more, but most people must have seen these crimes are being trivial and not worth reporting.
agree with everything else heliotrope says, it's not as if tent robbers wear big signs or anything, they just look like average festival goers (to me anyway).
If they really wanted to...
Beat some festival crime, the police should pull over the 1000s upon 1000s of drunk drivers leaving the festival.
Instead of helping them on their way.
Idea
Maybe a crime amnesty is the way forward, everybody should list the crimes they saw or maybe commited with no retribution, so the police can see just how much goes on and just whats needed.
1000's of crimes are commited even before the festival starts with the touting that goes on.
I've been...
...to over ten festivals, British and European, and never had anything stolen BECAUSE I don't take anything valuable.
80,000 people in the same area is always gonna equal crime; money and phone are all you need, if that, maybe just money.
Obviously if you are a cameraman the circumstances are different, but everybody knows that pikeys roam looking for valuables at festivals, so you just have to be aware.
I have also never been hit or started on at a fest...I think this is because I have never un-necessarily provoked anyone who good give me a damn good thrashing...but if you festival goers have been on the wrong end of a beating for NO REASON WHATSOEVER, then obviously, that is crap.
Festival crowds aren't that bad
if you got 80,000 people together anywhere else, there would be loads more trouble.
Crime is always going to happen at Reading
There is quite literally no way of preventing it. It's depressing, but true
80,000 people all in one large space. 260 crimes reported (obv there were many more). So by that logic one in every 300 people is a scumbag. That's pretty much what you'd expect, in my opinion. Then when you consider a lot of the thefts will be done by the same few, the ratio of decent human beings to cunts decreases further
Also, that many people and that much alcohol, drugs and excitement (16 year olds away from home for the first time fucked up on three cans of Carling) will always = violence to some degree
And realistically, how will extra cameras or extra security make any difference, in reality? A man walks into a tent, and walks out again with a shiny new phone. How is anybody going to know it wasn't his tent? And do you really think that if he was caught on CCTV he'd be identified in the next three days (maximum) amongst that many people?
Lockers would be one way, definately. As long as they are out of the way or protected somehow from the drunken pricks on Sunday night hell bent on tipping over anything they can find
So yeah, I'm a pessimistic sod. Life without crime would be amazing. As would a festival. But really, it's never going to happen, is it?
they have left luggage
no-one uses it. its not because theres a massive queue or anything, because no-one uses it. if people dont use that, why would they use lockers?
well
you can't beat crime at festivals any more than you can beat crime in the real world. you can reduce it, you can never get rid of it entirely. which, of course, isn't to say you shouldn't try.
however, the case of this lass who got raped at the leeds festival, well...that's something that really ought to be fucking beaten, ja?
...
the only things i take i take to reading are my cash card, about £80 in notes, my rail card and my mobile. i leave my keys and everything else at home and i've never ever taken a cd player/ipod/digital camera. i carry around all my cash and essential cards in a thin wallet (like the ones they give you for your rail card or oyster card) in my front pocket (leaving shit in your back pocket even at a festival is stupid as) and at times i've even put notes in my shoes. I also found taking a small lock and putting it on the double zip of my tent helps. it's not that noticable and puts people off getting in (could you really stand there for 5 minutes trying to get into the tent and not get noticed?)
reading this year offered a quiet camp area (i think it was it was in brown) which was admitted via paying an extra tenner i think and then you could only get in or out by having the right wrist band and that was in the camping area. if you are to take vaulables such as an slr camera (which lots of people do have to for work, like ben did) then maybe it's worth camping in the quiet area?
extra security would be an idea, but can you police in a dark field? how can you tell if someone's breaking into someone elses tent or their just simply quickly grabbing a jumper because they're cold? there was the whole fiasco at leeds last year with security wrongly holding people that they thought were causing shit.
i went to reading for five years on the trot and never had any trouble of any sort. then again, i never took anything that would attract attention. i hope ben gets his stuff back, some people are just utter fucking bastards. the thing is people can say "oh it's his fault for taking about a grand's worth of camera kit and it's obviously going to get nicked" but ben obviously took it for work purposes, it's his job afterall! it's like saying to a brick layerer "oh you can build that wall but you can't use any bricks or cement."
but it isn't just mp3s
I know I'm the distinct rareity in having something really valuable nicked and I recognise that but it's not the only time I've been robbed at a festival this summer and the other time it was devistating (not financially as this time) because I lost a load of clothes, the brand new rucksack i needed to carry my stuff in, a sleeping bag, photos, etc. It doesn't have to be expensive stuff going missing to wreck your weekend. My girlfriend was scared sick that someone had been in our tent while we were there. Why the fuck should she have to pay £145 to be scared to death by some cunt who has just wandered in and isn't stopped from wreaking havoc across the campsites unchallenged. That I lost £4000 of camera gear is one thing, that she had to put up with that is a whole other and neither of them is in any way acceptable.
Well said Marc
All sound advice. I have a slightly more depressing view.
Problem is - can you stop the crime? No. Why? Because there are a lot of idiots about. And anything on that scale, if you don't make it a police state (which you would never want to) is an "opportunity".
It doesn't stop me going, but it has stopped me camping there.
Name me anything in life that doesn't have a downside where idiots can spoil it for you. Every year the prime minister of the day gets lambasted when the crime statistics come out because, like, people are still being assaulted, mugged, whatever. But unless (for example) we banned all drinking, you wouldn't stop violence in town centres on weekends.
Idiots are everywhere. There's not really a lot you can do except take advice like Marc's, to enjoy yourself, try and stay out of trouble and hopefully avoid being a statistic. But can we reduce idiocy to a zero level? No.
Sorry to be unremittingly bleak. I'm normally the eternal optimist, something I achieve by thinking about this stuff as little as possible.
Yeah
About there. When you walked up the main road straight from the arena, go down the first left where the ice cream van was it was right there.
Yellow has always been the most dirty/fucked the two times I've been.
I think the scale is horribly distorted
Thanks to the internet...
In logical terms, you are in an open space. It's the equivalent of leaving your car open with stuff in it. There's always gonna be cunts. These cunts are not quite as braindead as you may think and when thousands of (let's face it, middle class) people congregate in a small area it's like a child in a (free) candy store.
Part of the appeal of a festival is the slight lawlessness, in terms of drugs and drink and generally wandering about with 100,000 other people. If you were to over-police it, people would end up thinking it was boring. Imagine the Police searching everyone for drugs and arresting every person who has had a bit too much to drink.
I think Glastonbury have done a great job, the big fence keeps people without tickets (generally the ones who caused problems) out, but they haven't gone mad on searching everyone and they've always provided free lock ups. Reading could and probably should follow suit but I dunno if smaller festivals could afford the kinda of security Glastonbury has (the fence cost over a million)
I think ultimately it's down to the individual. Be sensible. Take what you need. Keep everything on you.
Would this have even been a discussion point if a staffer hadn't been affected? I find it a bit odd that it's suddenly topic number one all over the place...
i always padlock my tent
it my sound a bit daft, but anyone breaking into tents is either going to have to knife mine (not very subtle) or piss off. They can't just wander in and pretend it's their tent.
also, necessary valuables - wristband, clothes, wallet, housekeys.
you don't need your mp3 player and you don't need your phone. Non-live music should be provided by a boom-box (nobody steals your tdk90s but you'll have to keep the stereo safe), and choral sing-alongs.
Finally, go with a big fuck-off gang so that if you catch anyone in the act you can hold them whilst one of you fetches the cops to take their wristband and chuck them out. going with a great big gang is more fun anyway.
i was in yellow
but at the right of the ice cream van. our area was really quite quiet though we did watch four teenage boys get taken away by the police on Friday morning. I never did find out what for though
people sometimes have things like food and clothes go missing
and may not have the money to replace these.
reading thefts
i lost my phone during the cribs set at reading despite it being in my front jeans pocket. think it was more a case of being knocked out of my pocket rather then being nicked
the quiet area at reading was white camp which was across the river. the powers that be stupidly decided to put all traffic in there on thursday and left two archaic boats to get people across but thats another story.
there is no way to stop crime at festivals, if cunts want to nick stuff they will. just dont take ipods, take copied cds instead of the originals, take a 12.99 stereo from asda instead of the one you got for xmas. wear beaten up converse instead of spanking new ones...its common sense. its a risk, but its one you have to take (even tho you shouldnt have to)
sadly, life can be shit. and at the end of the day, losing an ipod isnt that BAD compared to some crimes that go on
Drink
I really don't think the sponsorship helps at all. At leeds it was "WARM BEER IS EVIL!", "GO AND GET A COLD BEER NOW", "WHY AREN'T YOU DRINKING A COLD BEER?!", "DRINK DRINK DRINK DRINK DRINK" everywhere you looked.
Perhaps if they didn't push it so much, then everyone wouldn't be so pissed and may be a bit more aware of what's happening.
Everyone is amused by that funny welshman who comes and joins you because he can't find his tent, but he could easily just be eyeing you up to see if there's anything worth having. The fact that everyone is off their faces just seems to make people fail to notice it.
Personally, i don't like drinking at festivals, I go for the bands, and i wouldn't want to miss them because i have to queue for an hour for a beer. The fact that i was sober meant that i noticed a guy going into my tent whilst i was sitting 10 feet away from it, and i noticed a guy try to get my wallet out of my pants in the crush at the raconteurs.
So just a thought... stay sober, and keep an eye out.
Glasto has it best
I've been to a lot of festivals over the last decade. I started at Reading. Reading has gotten worse for crime (and music) whereas Glasto completely cleared up the moment Eavis put the big fence in. Yer crinamel types don't bother going to Glasto much these days, because they'd have to actually pay to get in before they could pilfer owt. Any old git can get into the camp sites at Reading. If they can't be bothered to sneak in they could even just buy a day ticket, which has got to be better on the old expenditure-ill gotten gains curve.
Fingers crossed for Bestival
Boo
Get pissed, then losing your wallet doesn't seem so bad...
have to say..
Big gangs are a definitve must.
I intervened at V over somemen throwing bottles randomly. They seem to be getting quite good at hitting random women which frankly I found pathetic. Of course after they justified it 'cos I can' (ha!) they kicked off but soon stopped when they realised the size of our group.
Isnt that a sad statement?
Free Lockers...
...are the only way forward.
They operate a free locker and phone recharge on every campsite at Roskilde and other than a couple of boring queues it's all pretty painless.
There must be something in the ever-escalting Reading ticket prices to cover a few compounds staffed by Oxfam freebie stewards.
how about
not being stupid enough to bring valuables? I survived the weekend without my iPod or my camera. I understand this isn't easy if you want to take professional photographs, but surely you could of kept it with you, or someone back at the tent, or even keep it in the car?
My friend who lost his phone actually got it back, so reading is not all bad news, yet i doubt Sir Ian Blair would be raving about how safe it is....
Reading hasn't got worse for crime
crime is down. It was down last year as well.
cuts to security
Mean Fiddler cut the number of volunteer Oxfam stewards at Reading by a quarter just two days before the festival. (The stewards work for free, but MF do pay; all the money goes to Oxfam.)
They also, I believe, cut security.
Strange thing to do when the numbers of punters went up by 13,500, eh?
'Mean' indeed...
13,500 more people
and crime down. That's good, no? Shouldn't we be applauding them?
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