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i'm gonna catch up to him using my lollerskates.
WAIT DID SOMEONE POST THIS ALREADY?
I always felt safe when he was in charge, even though I knew I wasn't. It's that smile. It just sort of makes it alright.
As much as he's fucked up, I would still have a beer with him. Sometimes I wish we were bros and could cruise bars looking for girls, maybe take a cute one home and *trails off*
The smile that masked the lies and deciet and cowradly behaviour he displayed whilst in power. Now he is using his new found religion to preach to us againa dn make the world a better place. It would be a fucking better place if you hadn't taken us to war you cunt. Man I fucking hate blair!
I mean it will have done if your Iraqi, in which cases it's moved from a shit situation from a small but significant number of people were likely to be killed horribly for the forseeable future with no clear end in sight to a different shit situation where a larger number of people are likely to be killed horribly for the forseeable future with a vaguely tangible end in sight at some point in the future but at a time nobody can really determine.
Outside of Iraq there hasn't really been that much of an increase in terrorism. We can never really know if there'd have been more or less terrorism had it not happened but there were a few attempts in the years before and a few attempts in the years after.
The only thing it's really changed is completely derailing neo-Conservatism for the timebeing due to the evident bullshit involved in the whole thing.
that it *has* changed the world, for the worst reasons. And you're viewing this as a Westerner.
The other way of reading what you've said is.
"For zero outcome, a lot of people have been killed on a vengeful/tactical whim. The US can do this when they want with our backing, and will do it again if they like - and ARE doing it again."
So, yeah. If you're you or me, it doesn't affect too much, because (I assume) neither of our mates died in that invasion.
But... that doesn't mean it's a relative also-ran.
I completely agree the "zero outcome" thing is depressing. I'm just questioning the idea of whether the world would be a better place it if hadn't happened. As Westerners we havea lot more ammo for liberal guilt about how we're fucking the world up but ultimately all that's changed in terms of Iraq iis - rather than being able to sit around ignoring all the people being killed in Iraq - we now feel its out responsibility. Which is bad for us. But from an Iraqi person's point of view I'm not sure whether it's better to live in a society where you potentially stand to be imprisoned, raped and murdered for expressing the wrong viewpoint or a society where you may be killed entirely at random at any moment.
My own view in terms of Iraq and Afghanistan is that, now we've opened this can of worms, we've got a responsibility to make sure both countries are left as safer societies with fairer governments and better quality of life than before we went in. Which is what makes both the apparent corruption and the talk of negotiations with the Taliban if Afghanistan so depressing...
And did the usual thing of assuming the worst.
But then again - maybe *the public* wants this to be about responsibility and not western benefit... but seeing as Tony is pulling the God card we'll never know what his own motivations were for this one. We got behind it for the right(ish) reasons, but those were never the ones sold.
I kind of see 'stan as that sweaty sort of lie that only goes away if you keep lying. Since 9/11, as long as there's SOME form of connection with [country] and Laden, republican America wants to kick it's ass, blindly. 'stan is like an issue to cloud others - not least the weapons/funding the US has previously sent to rebels there - and just a sort of running on water thing. If they keep going, they won't drown.
Also: is Iraq any safer? Will it be ever? Arguably not.
As I say - keeping that lie running to an unsure end-of-the-tunnel is better than just going "ah fuck you guys. Our bad," and walking away.
Iraq I'm a bit less clear on because of the mixed reports of what's going on there but in terms of Afghanistan it seems pretty clear the government and Afghani army is unlikely to be strong enough to hold out against the Taliban if America leave.
And we've got to remember the Taliban was a fucking horrific regime, so much so that there are many Afghanis in relatively secure places like Kabul who see the current situation - even with all of its uncertainties, corruption and bloodshed - as far more preferable to a return to Taliban rule. For the Afghanistani people to go through what they've been through for the last eight years and then go back to being under an oppressive theocracy would be pretty much the worst thing the West could inflict on the country.
And in terms of Iraq it would be great if the US found a way to withdraw from there, and it's obviously deplorable that most of the main rebuilding contracts have found their way to US companies but it'd still be a terrible thing to do to the people of the country to walk away until the government and army is strong enough to withstand a theocratic coup.
As I say in my previous post we've opened a can of worms we should never have opened and destablilised a volatile situation. But sadly I don't think we can ethically leave until we find a way to clear up the mess.
really is better than walking away!
But I mean...terrible regimes? Mugabe? I mean: CHINA?
We pick the fights we want to pick.
Your trolling again, and assuming I'm a leftie too, which is interesting in itself. I would bet money on you assuming I'm working class too, and the stigma you'd attach to it.
I was talking about what has very been a clear lie concerning WMDs etc. Possible right moral agenda, very wrong line to sell. The inner cabinet couldn't believe it when WMDs weren't found, trusting Blair's confidence as much as they did.
You are clumsy. See post below on embarrassing yourself.
I mean it was pretty obvious to anyone who gave it more than fifteen minutes thought that the removal of Saddam Hussein would create a power vacuum and internal conflict. So it's utterly unforgivable that the US & UK were taken by surprise.
I more meant that there's always more public outcry from the dem supporters.
But it's nice that you went for the anti-left agenda in the middle of a reasoned debate.
and selling the public a lie... I was slamming the right?
You *can't debate*. Stop trying! You're consistently beaten by 90 per cent of this board through reasoned argument, then troll out of frustration/anger/a hereditary undiscovered wish that we were your manservants so you wouldn't have to deal with dissent, and THEN laugh about being a troll because it stops your brow furrowing.
Only debate if you can read more than slogans. Please don't embarrass yourself any more.
But of those involved in this country in championing the war... he's lefter than the Tories who also backed it. Also not every single MP has been in the enquiry so I didn't have a tonne of people to pick from...
Although if it becomes an official warcrime (it'll never happen) is everyone who backed it guilty of manslaughter?
It would be pandemonium, and parliament would be...what?
It would be an officially-sanctioned revolution, and I'm probably right in saying the only one of it's kind ever.
you know, politicians actually living by the rules they impose.
And very possibly incite more riots/revolution/probably mainly riots internationally than anyone would ever believe.
Your source needs citations, you sweaty-handed inbreeder! :-D
I'm not entirely sure he hasn't taken the best course of action in the circumstances.
George W Bush looks like a fun guy to go for a pint with. Obviously he should never have been in charge of a terrifying nation like the USA, but I bet he'd be good fun to go out on the razz with.
that in person he's warm and funny, contrary to all appearances in the media?
RACK EM UP, I'M GOING TO SHOOT THIS GINGER ONE'S LEGS OFF, TOMMO! :-D *pisses on floor, smashes beer bottle.*
I didn't really have anything to say about it... haven't read either version.
That sounds like grounds for a noise abatement notice or an ASBO, not an expensive trial at the Hague.
Poor show, Monbiot.