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and if i forget them i put in my in ear earphones
You're not going to loud enough gigs.
I had earplugs in at SunnO))) on Sunday, and still my whole head was ringing for about 24 hours afterwards. It was like my skull was vibrating.
It's going to hit you sooner or later.
surely it's not inevitable. Some people just go completely deaf instead, like me. I have started wearing earplugs now but frankly it never sounds as good or as exciting.
What I really hate is when bands who are wank play really loud and I forget my earplugs. I don't mind being deafened by Converge or something.
Took me precisely 1.
i'm the same way.
What is there to discuss? If you don't do this then you are deafening yourself. End of story/.
Thats not a story
Id hate to be your kids at bedtime
accumulating much more damage than the occasional gig
How do you work that out given that these hypothetical people are probably more, not less likely to have considered the impact of loud music to their hearing?
we went to see the eagles of death metal together and were right up front but after one song, kevin's ears were ringing so badly that he had to watch the entire gig from the very back of the club, which sucked. luckily for him, he's tall.
and 4 poofs.
But I haz tinnitus innit.
an 4 poofs.
...with the DJ playing ear-bleedingly loud by the end of the night.
Now, wearing ear-plugs at clubs. DiScuss.
I can't hear you!
and also remember the days (1990s) before noise pollution laws meant that gigs are now much quieter than they used to be, loud though they may still remain.
i may well get tinnitus. this may well make me an idiot. but i, like many other people, blindly do a whole shitload of unhealthy things all the time.
plus, My Bloody Valentine, without earplugs, was one of the loudest and best experiences of my life.
and listen to a cd of band I'm seeing.
but I didn't for a long time meaning that when I lay in bed at night I can still hear the sound of a hissing boiler.
I also have a decent pair of noise cancelling headphones so that I can have the volume down low on my iPod.
I love music, and I don't don't understand how any other music lovers (especially those that like loud stuff) wouldn't be scared at the thought of not being able to hear it properly in the future.
is whether listening to music on headphones almost all day every day damages your hearing. I certainly don't listen to my music LOUD but I worry that the cumulative effect is still damaging. Or is it only when noise is above a certain threshold that damage is done?
The cumulative effect is damaging in the sense that the louder a particular frequency is, the harder it is for the ear to handle it. Once you pass a certain level, that frequency is gone from your perception forever.
At a gig, the short sharp shock of a sudden loud noise puts the needle right into the red straight away. You register the discomfort and protect yourself accordingly. Listening to music on headphones, you're gradually putting pressure on the loudest frequency your ear can currently handle. When that level of sound goes, you go down to the next, on and on until one day you're like "I swear I used to be able to hear that." The crucial difference is that you can control the volume of your mp3 player. Not so the live show.
In-ear phones are by a long sight worse than cup-style headphones. Even the expensive ones.
as they have a fuck load of high end and I find my ears are really knackered after those ones.
But then when I go to subdub, which is the loudest bigest soundsystem around pretty much, as they play stuff which is mainly a fuck load of bass my ears seem alright after.
I recently invested in a pair of Elacin ER20s after getting a bit of tinnitus. I was scared shitless about going to see the next 2 gigs in my calendar as I don't think you could have two more punishing bands:
Part Chimp and SunnO)))
Thankfully these bad boys actually filtered out the horrible, damaging top end sounds making the gig not only more bearable but also more audible. Anyone actually heard the "tap tap" on ride cymbal during a Part Chimp gig? Sorry, can't hear you... WHAT WAS THAT?!! SORRY, SAY THAT AGAIN!!
you can probably listen to sunnO)) for while right next to a monitor and not get tinnitus....
its the high end stuff like cymbals and jangly guitar that fucks your ears up
end of schtory.
When I got my tinnitus I thought to myself, "Surely the boys from Part Chimp must have it really bad, I'll need ask them at the gig."
Cut to me outside The Lexington chatting to Johnny and Tim, asking them if they'd ever had ear problems. "No" was the reply from the pair of them, "We always use earplugs."
Take note kiddies.
Like marckee said a bit further up, I love music way too much, the thought of losing / damaging my hearing because of it - I don't want that to happen.
- you've been to so many gigs that they're necessary
- you're a musician and they're necessary
- you realise going deaf through listening to the music that you love would be proper shit, hence, they're necessary.
That's how I feel when I wear ear-plugs: informed, wise and aloof.
although i use cheap disposable ones.
had tinnitus since i was 20 :(
they don't really have any real effect.
depends on the brand.
listening to absurdly loud sound for a couple of hours is my idea of fun. but that only happens on a monthly basis or something. if i was a weekly gig goer id probably be sick to death of the racket and invest in some suave ear accessories, so y'know; your instincts tell you everything. ignore the warnings!
I made the mistake of forgetting my earplugs when I went to see A Place To Bury Strangers at ATP last year, and that was enough to lose a frequency of hearing and gain an ear of permanent hiss.
I was saying to a friend as I walked in: "No, I don't know much about them, apart from the programme kept going on about how loud they are. But I'm assuming that's just, like, hyperbole, right? I mean, how loud are they really gonna b–– WHOA, FUCK"
the though of hearing them at the ICA frightened my ears.
since them i've been going to progressively louder gigs and when i forgot them i really notice badly. emeralds was completely muffled after pain jerk, the flower-corsano gig left me half deaf in my left ear for a good 30 hours after. but then i rememebred and took them to sunn 0))) and they worked a treat.
basically i don't wear them for every gig but i try to for the louder gigs.
to be honest, if you're going to see Bon Iver at the Shepherds Bush Empire you'll be alright.
In contrast, if you're at ATP and are seeing Fuck Buttons, Earth, Boris, Sunn o)) and Aphex play, then you need to plug the fuck up.
All the people who say they've already got tinnitus: is it a constant thing or just an occasional ringing?
Not too loud, unless I'm lying in bed and everything's quiet. Gets louder after gigs then goes back down to pretty much the same level after a day.
mine is similar to this.
I sometimes wonder if I've got a mild version of it; occasionally I get a high-pitch tone, but it rarely lasts more than about ten seconds and drifts away to nothing, sometimes going when I move my head.
Fingers crossed I started wearing ear-plugs just in time.
To be honest, I don't really notice it or think about it too much, apart from when things are silent and I'm trying to sleep. I usually have some background noise on but I don't NEED it to go to sleep. I've had it when I was 16 and it doesn't really affect my life too much, you learn to live with it...
they supposedly ridiculously loud but I think its more intense bass than shrill screechs, but I don't really know. Advice?
i saw them late last year and it was both really loud and really intense. the contents of my stomach were shaking.
this was in reply to the post about black dice down there.
no discussion needed
at work I'm lucky enough to be able to listen to music all day through headphones. The downside is tinitus is coming on strong.
What ear plugs do people wear at gigs?
that GOOD earplugs are essential, cheap ones will simply take away most of the high frequencies, which will protect but make things sound worse. it's worth getting some good quality ones which make all the frequencies quieter.
my dad went to see Black Sabbath in about '70/'71 and he said he couldn't hear for 3 days afterwards. i bet it was the best gig ever tho!
wearing good earphones with your MP3 player is a good plan, if you use noise-cancelling ones then you don't have to turn up as much to drown out the bus/tube/annoying people etc.
is being hit by a bus. Surely not being able to hear ANYTHING is a really bad idea?
They gave them out at MY Bloody Valentine, I tried it for 1 song but it sounded shit so took them out.
that they arranged it so the sound pressure levels wouldn't be damaging to hearing, or at least I think so.
kevin is very adamant that people wear earplugs at mbv gigs.
I know that they hand them out, but i read something about the sound pressure dealy somewhere.
"He is also aware of how volume can affect the organs that control balance, and can in turn be used to create a state of disorientation. "We play with low frequencies that are nothing like anyone has ever heard before - it's a chaos that sets off a kind of inbuilt alarm system. We use psychoacoustic effects so it sounds louder than it actually is in sound pressure levels. When we played at The Roundhouse we were hitting the resonant frequencies of some parts of the building and so things were rattling and shaking, and dust and plaster falling down."
But is he not concerned about using potentially harmful sound levels? "It does bother me, that's why I made sure earplugs were available and that we play within tried and tested sound pressure levels with a limit of 119dB(A). We also never overdrive the PA, which can provide spike of distortion up to 130dB. We'd like to say that it is cool to wear earplugs; it's not cool to get your hearing damaged. And anyway, feeling the music is a great experience.""
yeah always. i'm not keen on the idea of irreversible deafness, having tinnitus already is bad enough
i bought earplugs to go to ATP a couple of years ago because i knew there would be some mega loud bands playing. I was so glad i had them when Wolf Eyes were playing. So glad.
I have proplugs, i only really wear them if i think it's going to be really loud, like for noise gigs and stuff like mogwai. I always forget them anyway though so it's a moot point.
obviously you want a bit of physical presence to the music, but so many sound engineers seem to think that cranking everything up to the red somehow makes it more exciting. Bullshit. You have to find the right sound for the venue, keep the bump but remove the screech. Why the fuck would you want to put up with sound waves violently resonating off every crevasse of the room? Why the fuck would you want to live with the auditory damage because some fucking morons have no idea about sound?
I happen to like my ears, ta very much. So i treat them nice, and that includes not subjecting them to live music
wearing a blindfold at the cinema might actually improve your moviegoing experience. especially if you're going to see Benjamin Button.
there was this guy, whose name i forget, and even forget where he lived and when he did this, but he used to pay for a day pass to the cinema and go in wearing weird crystal classes that reflected the picture at all sorts of different angles, and he'd go into one film, watch it for a bit like that, then duck out and into another, and make his own narrative up out of all the fragments he saw. i mean, not the most constructive way to spend your life, but seems like it'd be at least a saturday well spent.
not heard any of the good albums. Sacrilegious?
look at htis intreview w/ sly stone http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bM_Pf7JhKWo&e
tactile, personable, not up to his eyeballs on coke, not falling into mental illness. Perfect light entertainment fodder
False analogy: If the screen at the cinema projected images that blinded you, you would think about taking eye protection.
Furthermore, you are obviously confused about what people are referring to when they talk about earplugs: Most people (well, the educated ones) don't just stuff up their ears during a gig. They have ear PROTECTION, which rather than muffling all sound, just shield the ears from harmful frequencies, allowing them to hear the actual music with greater clarity.
Factual inaccuracy: MP3 players will not do more damage to your hearing than the odd gig. For one thing, you don't have to be a doctor to be able to deduce that the louder the noise, the more damage it will cause with continued exposure - all you have to do to find this out is try it and wait for the pain, as many gig-goers have done. How you can even think to try and deny this common fact beggars belief.
Here are some facts for you: The level of sound at which continuous exposure will damage hearing is at about 95 decibels. MP3 players are limited by law to 100 decibels. Your average rock gig will feature sound at anywhere from 110 to 130-something decibels. Any noise upwards of 125 decibels causes pain and therefore damage. Conclusion: Listening to an MP3 player at a decent volume level and without using £3.99 Tesco in-ear pieces will do fuck all to your ears (at least for a few decades anyhow), going to a gig every weekend without ear plugs definitely will, and moreover, the damage will be noticeable after a comparatively short amount of time.
You chat a lot of shit, and that's fine - it's the internet; stupidity isn't a crime, and often it's funny. But to actually potentially endanger people with your ignorance: You win Retard of the Week.
Again, astonishing work there, mate. Almost like one of your film reviews.
Now I know you have a lot on your schedule, what with all the work it takes to trawl DiS for threads about things, write "It was shit." or "It just wasn't interesting." and press 'send', but when you can't even find the time to come up with any better acceptance speech for your RotW award than 'I know you are but what am I?', well maybe you need to think about where your life is going.
It sounds a bit dull.
are in a constant state of wanting to pop. I got my tinnitus from constantly wearing headphones rather than going to loads of gigs i think. It got progressively worse until now where i can pretty much always hear it, even over other noise.
I was nearly deafened at a Bosstones gig, so I decided it might be a good idea. Used these cheap ones from boots for a while, then found out about ER-20s and been using them ever since. I find I can hear the music much, much clearer, plus if someone asks me something when the band are playing I can actually hear them!
Good quality earplugs make the music far clearer.
I've been at gigs when the people with me have complained that the sound was too muddy and you couldn't hear the vocals, and I've been thinking, well I could hear the vocals crystal clear...
although I did once when I was watching a local band and I can totally see what people mean by it actually improves the clarity of the music. I've APTBS coming up in april so I'll probably wear some then.
I photograph at gigs a lot, and find myself in unusual postitions, such as on the floor near the stage.
Suddenly I think 'Why is my ear sort of vibrating?', Then look to my left and see a huge fuck-off speaker has been bellowing in my ear without me realising.
I also photograph gigs in Belgium and never go without them.
The ER-20 are really great and confortable http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er20.aspx). The idea of buying them came after I toke pictures of a band called Tringgerfinger at a festival. I thought they look ok (on CD). Live that's kind of different (loud loud and loud). That's when I realised that my afternoon was finished. Couldn't hear a thing anymore.
i'll probably be half deaf by 30, but i just can't do it. i can't justify turning up to a gig, paying money and then spoiling the gig by putting plastic in my ears. sounds terrible.
and i can't play music/gigs with them in either, can't get into it properly.
You sound like those men who refuse to wear condoms because it stops them feeling it. If your piece of shit £2 earplugs don't do the trick, do yourself a favour and invest in better ones.
my ear plugs cost £10. shite.
i'd read this thread before going to see Gang of Four at last year's Great Escape, would have saved me from tinnitus :(
gigs more as it takes away alot the high frequencies. Nothing better than enjoying a gig and waking up without ringing ears.
I haven't done it for a while though as I lost my ER-20s. :(
I really wish I had...
My brain felt like it was oscillating for a good 12 hours after while the ringing whine is still feintly present.
Not good, I felt sorry for the blind bloke I saw in there though!
saw Sunn0))) on saturday night in a midgety venue and even with earplugs my ears were a bit wonky after..
they just seem to reduce feedback and stuff without muffling sound
and only like 8 quid for a pair
do i really need to replace them?
i got them because after band practices, the ear that was closest to the amp would do that weird popping thing. Since i got them it hasn't happened at all :)
at how many folk seem to deny the fact that loud music - live or via earphones or whatever - can damage you hearing. sound levels as low as 70 dB can do irrepairable damage to your hearing. GOOD earplugs filter the sound, attenuating the overall sound pressure levels getting into your ears. I've been using ER20's but will be upgrading very soon to moulded earplugs that will last me several years. but that won't unfortunately cure the tinnitus i have already. tinnitus can be constant hiss, buzzing or ringing or it can be a tone / buzz that you get for a few seconds / minutes. and it is not just prolonged exposure that will cause it - it can be triggered by one loud noise, 1 gig, 1 tube ride with your earphones in.
plug up if you ever want to appreciate silence again.
when i saw a place to bury strangers/japandriods i was standing at the front, next to a free-standing speaker with no earplugs and my ears have never been the same since. more recently i saw mastodon and forgot to buy earplugs, and by the time they played the last baron my ears were fucked and it sounded echoey :'(
i'm not seeing a loud band again without earplugs ever. quieter ones are fine without i think
A Place To Bury Strangers Tinnitus club member!
made fun of ppl with ear plugs, but as i'm getting older, if i attend a couple of loud gigs in the same week my ears are fucked, i had to watch oceansize with my head turned to the left last year as i'd just come off this will destroy you & biffy, same with if i play guitar too loud for an hour or so, think it might be time to join the douches
ive ever been to for ringing was Starsailor in Birmingham
So jangly i was ringing for days!
...if you like it loud, wear protection.
The problem with things like this is most people only act when it's too late. When you start getting tinnitus, you have done yourself permanent irrepairable damage. Every time your ears ring after a gig, that's permanent damage. Irreversible damage... And the consequences can be atrocious.
Although the strangest 'cause of tinnitus' I've heard is from golfers who've claimed that new titanium drivers have been damaging their hearing due to the exceptionally high pitch that the sound of the ball 'pinging' off the clubface makes. Weird.
I take earplugs to any gig that's likely to get loud, and I'm really glad of them. Some gigs you can't even hear properly without them because it's just too damn loud (sounds contradictory, but I've found it to be true); my ears quickly adjust to the lower sound level and I feel just as immersed in the music as I would without. Possibly more so, because I'm not getting distracted by how punishingly loud things are.
There've been a lot of mentions of the ER20s; I use the Alpine MusicSafe ones, and they're also excellent at reducing the volume without muffling the sound.