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I think I'll wait till Cameron gets elected though. That way I can make my death mean something.
"They suggest the reason for the Heath blip was that his government coincided with the introduction of natural gas in the UK, which made it instantly harder for those who wished to kill themselves."
It took 4 years of research to find alternative methods in time for Thatcher...
Doesn't take the most fundamental issue into consideration; what constitutes a suicide. Seeing as attitudes and legislation towards suicide is drastically different across periods of times and countries, any comparison across two is invariably flawed.
he's not here, i'm having some fun.
Over a 100 years there were Labour governments in power so the suicide rate dropping when they're in power is surely an indicator that they do rise?
I loved the recent revelation that people weren't really swinging towards the Tories, they were just no liking Labour and wouldn't vote Tory necessarily if they could help it.
yesterday. I mean his speech. I don't fancy him or anything. Though he is looking a little less waxy these days.
huh? huh? huh?
But that fact doesn't provide insight if isolated that way. Who is to say that the actual number of people committing suicide hasn't remained static and what has really changed is attitude to suicide?
Surely if the numbers of people committing suicide goes up under a conservative government then the actual number isn't remaining static. I don't understand what you're arguing.
over the last few decades; in some periods/places, a coroner has absolutely needed to see a suicide note in order to classify a death a suicide. Under more liberal legislation, such evidence is necessary. Not all suspected suicide cases are cut and dry.
Maybe suicide rates have gone up under the Tories, I wouldn't know. What I do know is that the statistics offered by the article don't present a convincing argument without a wider discussion.
which would seem to be that under Liberal administrations the evidence rules change, but those are part of law.
Yes you're right in the sense of comparing between 1901 and 1999 but clearly, say, the four years of Labour between two Tory terms early in the century don't allow for this to affect anything because it's a lot harder to reform the law and generally such reforms aren't instantly thrown out by the incoming Tory government.
with 'less stringent' then. I should have known better than to use a politically-charged term in a discussion with you :P
I really wish I had greater knowledge retention because I studied this in great detail a few years back, and looked at the circumstances under which a conservative government comes to power and how that affected suicide rates.
Besides, I'm not defending the Tories as such. I'm saying the article provides half an argument.
when the papers publish their synopsis of research papers. For it to get anywhere near being published in academia there's probably far stronger evidence involved that that reproduced in that article. In that sense, it's no different to most of the selected stats from the ONS that various papers decide to publish without context.
All I'm doing though is pointing out the flaws in a Guardian article in the exact same way a whole load of people jump on 'Hmmm...interesting' Telegraph stories.
but that's more to do with my inherent distrust of statistics that involve people and their decisions about things.
However, I still think you're arguing about an administration's effect on law, which isn't really very likely in the way this study is carried out.
If you want to pick big holes in it, I'll join you stroking chin at their claim they've accounted for external factors like economic issues and wars. Yerright. :D
More to do with attitudes in certain places and time, and they are usually the product of much more than whoever happens to be in power.
I'd like to know how exactly they accounted for those external factors.
openly admit to basing this on "crude statistics". but still, cameron smells.
the "attitude to suicide" changes to a more "suicide-friendly" stance when the tories are in power.
I see what you're saying.
Just wait until Cliche comes back from the party conference, you can post stuff like this then.
How was that? Maybe I should practice
some half baked reactionary nonsense in the Telegraph and start a thread. Can't be that hard can it?
if the same number of people a year are committing suicide, the percentage will rise as the population will have decreased?
Because the only way people die is through suicide.
And giving birth was outlawed in the mid-70s.
It's Wednesday morning, alright, give me some slack.
at comitting suicide under Tories because they have more of a CAN-DO! GET ON-YOUR-BIKE-AND-END-IT-ALL-NOW attitude whereas under Labour they just expect THE STATE TO PROVIDE suicide machines.
He should be back tomorrow, and I'm sure he'll have plenty to say for himself.
just a member or something higher
a street TEAMER...
that it's intended to be.