Your are viewing a read-only archive of the old DiS boards. Please hit the Community button above to engage with the DiS !
(Have we done this thread yet?)
I've never been in an uber
(taken an uber? ubered?)
Is there a specific context for this one or are you just trying to generate some more page hits to drain ESA's coffers?
No specific context, just wanted to see someone lay into them a bit.
Like Air B'n'B it's completely deregulating a market and probably will have massive knock-on effects in a few decades, like Thatcher's council housing sell off stuf.
I quite like the idea of people using their actual home as a holiday home. Possibly better for touristy places that are otherwise deserted out of season.
I guess there's a bit of 'he who doesn't work, doesn't eat' about these things though.
by landlords and multiple-property owners, especially in London.
Just have to sofa surf a few weekends a month
Like Uber, I presume the bottom line is the consumer is fully protected, but I don't know if they are.
Equally, there's a certain amount of giving people who already have money more money, if you get me? I only worry that 10-20 years down the line we find that (say) many people are renting via an Air B'n'B system where their 'landlord' can effectively remove them at the drop of a hat.
to the point where rents will be increased on the expectation that the flats will be used for airbnb, to the extent that no one will be able to afford to live in a place and not operate it as an unregulated hotel
Airbnb somehow feels a little bit different because it's with property... and kind of fuck people who make money off renting property.
AirBnB instead of renting out properties.
i just don't understand the property market as well as the labour market so i make sweeping generalisations.
tenants essentially working second jobs advertising, communicating, cleaning, concierging their own mini hotels
certainly not directly, let alone directly.
also there's a reason hotels are regulated.
it's race-to-the-bottom neoconservative shite that will make everything worse. i still use it because i cant afford to go on holidays otherwise, but i dont lie to myself about somehow sticking it to the man
yeah airbnb is probably awful in the long run too
and fair working conditions in the industry... All of that stuff. That's all I know.
The guy couldn't operate a satnav or understand the concept of dropping some passengers off before the final stop. We had to keep re-entering the destination postcode into the app and uploading it to his satnav for him.
Was convenient I guess but no cheaper than a normal cab up there. Will probably just stick to using them in London where it's the only way I can afford to get a cab.
unbiased explanation of how it works in <100 words pls.
You are offered a fare.
If you accept one of the many random people with a car who've signed up as Uber drivers will come and collect you.
you get a cab for cheaper than a cab costs in london
how it works for society:
and then when you see one near you, you flag it down virtually and it magically appears on your doorstep and some guy still tells you all his shit political opinions that you don't want to hear but it costs you half the price.
Undercuts other cabbies (because they work non-stop on shifts they're not hunting for fares or waiting in an office),so is cheap but kills other businesses etc
you're effectively paying to hitchhike.
i thought I read they were registered as private hire cars or something?
They have the same licence as a minicab driver, without the guarantees on fares that they offer, and they operate as black cab drivers, with none of the higher level of licencing/security.
Apparantly no-one really cares?
When you came out of a club in the West End you'd regularly get a bunch of guys just hanging around on street corners offering to drive you home for a price.
by which Tower Records would open until 12am and thus be able to shift CDs at £16.49 a pop: drunk people make poor decisions.
This is a great business model. Did they have a bouncer?
by using them instead of taxis.
No wonder taxi drivers hate them. Wouldn't use them if I was a woman by myself though.
Guardianships (not the paper, that's a given)
I reckon squattings a human right tbh and paying for the privellege to stop that happening is pretty gross, just because you don't want to deal with the filthy rent system. Also they have weird rules like no friends after 9pm, don't like the idea of dictating to tennants.
camelot etc should have to make a choice: are they renting out a place a bit cheap cos it's a bit shit and they might need people to move out at short notice, or are they keeping buildings "safe" by placing people there under odd conditions? cos as it is, they're making money from the owners and the guardians arent they
Both for shitcunt entitled tory babies, but this seems to have been covered above. As you were.
got to be another couple of old-timers I don't know about?
You made me Google it though. I could've sworn there were a load of adverts where a bloke claimed he WAS Paul Masson weren't there? Turns out he died in 1940 and Orson Welles did the adverts (but never drank the booze). So I must have imagined it.
because my mate had Poleconomy and this was one of the companies. Paul Masson's California Carafes had a great rhythm to it when you read it out.
He's gone proper feral.
"But Uber Bristol's general manager, Fred Jones, said Uber's drivers are no different to other taxi drivers in the city. All Uber drivers in the UK have passed an enhanced Disclosure and Barring Service (DBS) check.
"People seem to think that Uber has a different way of operating when it comes to drivers being regulated, but it doesn't," Fred explained. "Drivers are subject to the same checks by the local authority, and all of our Bristol drivers have worked closely with the city council. And are insured as private hire cars in exactly the same way as other taxis.""
but operate as de facto black cab drivers.
increases standards and drives down prices.
To the gold plated genitals thread?
They'll take a bit of a hit though when, thanks to Boris Johnson, the tube opens 24 hours at weekends later this year.
It provides a fast, efficient, cost effective service that brings a taxi straight to wherever you are - even if you're too drunk to know where that is! Where's the issue?
Destroys smaller firms, unregulated and lack of driver checks, tax avoidance, being prosecuted for letting drivers go around with no insurance
I mean in principle there's nothing wrong with a taxi firm having an app but this lot are pretty grim
I'm very guilty of using it quite regularly, though, and probably will continue to do so.
but realised I use it quite a lot anyway.
that's probably a million times worse though right
And according to whistleblowers they all photoshop their mots or whatever they need to
So it's more they don't check their drivers thoroughly, to the point of negligance.
Yep, every single one of them.
is allegedly 'letting' drivers drive under the Uber banner without insurance - the rest of the points can be ignored.
But as ever, there's no obligation to use Uber. If you want to stand on a street corner late at night for a longer amount of time in the hope a black cab happens to drive past, and then pay a higher price for the privilege once you get in it, then go right ahead. It's your choice.
forgot about megataxi.
the past hour. You have no idea how bored I am.
Hopefully he will finish soon. I want him to go! I refuse to listen to him from now on and I don't care if he can hear me typing.
it's the trainer!
Twenty Twelve, The Thick Of It, Banana/Cucumber. Plus Confetti, which just might be the worst film of all time.
really affects a lot of drivers, bad for society.
The drivers you guys have as friends. And who you support during strikes.
even in passing, even just when taking a cab. Just to see what they think.
a shock, I'm sure.
On the other hand, DiS is a funny one for this kind of thing.
best to just sort of blunder into threads and poop out something rubbish.
I was a major player of the taxi driver riots of 2007
at this rate they're making a predicted loss just to get the name 'Hackney Carriage' out there.
like, last time i was in an Uber the guy pointed out that it's the only one he'll find where he gets to pick his hours. And he put it like: "i'm never going to make millions, but getting back to my kids at the hour i want to doesn't really exist in any other avenue of employment that makes me as much money as this."
Which... you know. That's a pretty good case for being in favour of Uber. Flexible employment that's a rarity to someone of his means.
Genuinely no idea what you're arguing here? That DiS shouldn't have an opinion on Uber because DiSers might not be friends with taxi drivers, and that DiSers wouldn't support taxi drivers striking(?), but because you had a conversation with an Uber driver who liked Uber that's reason to disregard the opinions of striking taxi drivers?
bored and flailing. Equally unsure
Come back tomorrow and show these suckers the old xylo jab.
I absolutely adore Uber and Airbnb. Both are fucking excellent ideas.
Don't really get what the issue is. It's totally cool for individuals to make as much extra money as they can from stuff they already own (eg. car, house, sofa etc.).
with a broad blanket, without acknowledging the fact that hotels and taxis have been gouging us for fucking years though. I'm not on either side, (I do quite like airbnb though) but it's been very 'ohhhh, the poor establishment' in here. Weird.
that people fought tooth and nail for, to gain work rights and social protection and are having it stripped away further and further by the kind of service. One which encourages it's drivers to piss in bottles while driving and store them in the car rather than miss the targets for a service they'll be underpaid for providing anyway and reduces the viability of earning a decent livelihood for existing drivers, generally to the benefit of a middle class clientele in a way that will proliferate the already horrendous inequality in this country...
Do you think you might be being just a little(bird) dramatic?
H & M or Primark?
people care about uber because they're exploiting people in our own country, rather than people in a third world country who have a much shitter deal to start with.
Uber's pricing is changing taxi rides from a middle class treat into something a far broader section of society can partake in.
(As your mum remarked to me)
this is all "the market will provide"
the market will not provide
Nobody cares about hotels in the problems they have with airbnb, taxi drivers aren't the establishment, taxis services are often bad but uber solves this problem by creating a bunch of shitty problems, both services put nice things in reach of a lot of people that previously couldn't afford them so they could quite literally be run by Hitler and loads of people would still use them.
Think that covers it all
2. Even got a Hitler argument out of it. Definitely one of my more successful endeavours.
but so are the places you by your clothes, toiletries, and pretty much anything else, in fact probably worse.
in your choices.
Whining that other companies are worse is an easy way to absolve everyone of social responsibility and the fastest way to the bottom.
and you have my kudos for that, and I'm not saying this should be ignored necessarily, but the fact there are worse out there going ignored or accepted while people are getting upset about these is a little incongruous.
Uber are run by shits so I get it, but there have to be ways for people to match the convenience and be competitive (Which has already happened in the states with lyft etc). I wouldn't lump air bnb in with that though, as the comparison is a good idea mainly used correctly by most people, which is then exploited by some cunts which is quite different.
And now you're trying the old "ugh, you can't complain about x because y worse thing"? Come on, man.
bacon dogsare good though
At least the taxis ran on time.
"Creative destruction" innit. Economies of scale. The inherent mechanisms of capitalism that blended with human ingenuity and technological progress lead to net societal benefits.
Nah. The savings come from the increased flexibility that arises when you circumvent regulation, taxes and structure.
You can argue that the last of those can be justified ethically, but the first two directly lead to net societial losses.
Artificially kept prices high for consumers.
I accept your point that Uber's corporate structure exists in a way designed to reduce their tax liabilities. From my reading I can't see that they have done anything illegal.
Your assumption in the last clause of your final sentence is just that, an assumption, which you have presented as a statement of fact. Millions of people having the opportunity to travel around cities quicker and cheaper versus the lost tax revenue that comes from black cabs and licensed minicabs. Let's not forget here that the individual drivers are liable for their own taxes as self-employed people - if Uber didn't exist what would they be paying instead? If they were jobless as a result, or earning less income, would they be paying less?
Both the driver and the vehicle are licenced. The driver should be 'fit and proper' and the vehicle 'safe and suitable'.
the "monopoly", which isn't a monopoly, is a side product
Uber have a history of pulling extremely dubious shit on their closest rival in the states, in order to achieve... a monopoly.
Lying and calling this sort of thing a monopoly is one of my top favourite bits of tory doublespeak bullshit. Marvellous.
sure you don't mean black cabs there pal?
if cg likes it you know it's bad
Plus I have a car cause I'm not a big 👶🏻
No problem with Uber, Ok they aren't great when it comes to ethical practice and employee rights, but it was clearly the same for black cabs and minicabs,so fuckem.
uber are cheap and they're fucking up a monopoly with tech that's easily transportable, so that's a good thing once unions and regulations catch up
That aside - It's important not to confuse uber's app with its innovation. Apps that can get a cab to you at the touch of a button predated uber significantly - Hailo could call you a black cab in London long before uber could.
Uber's innovation is how it flaunts labor laws by pretending to be a matchmaking service of sorts rather than an employer. People do have other problems with the company, but this is the most fundamental - it's this that makes uber "disruptive", and depending on your feelings about laws that protect employees and so on is why uber is great or not so great.
In the states, where this has been boiling away longest, the tide seems to be turning against uber getting away with claiming it's drivers are merely contractors - see the link below and Liss-Riordan's massive lawsuit. It'll be interesting to see how it pans out.
to realign public perception of them as being what they pretend to be, where everyone's experience of them is of them being identical to addison lee
but they still managed to defy for some months our taxi drivers lobby.
You don't have to use Uber if you don't like it. More expensive, less convenient options still remain available.
18 hours to actually come up with a good reposte?
Your powers are weak, old man.
(Also, xylo's completely killed you dead.)
They're just listing reasons why they think Uber are/aren't cunts. What's your beef
and in a few years time when there are no black cabs left, vulnerable people in remote areas won't have a publically licenced service that's obliged to serve them
(i believe this is actually an issue, but am not certain of the details and am happy to be proven wrong)
Black cabs are not supposed to refuse a fare.
for having a measured rate and higher charges)
Unfortunately, technology seems to have overtaken (or is in the process of overtaking) the need for black cabs - which I guess started with sat navs undermining the need for 'the knowledge'. They are becoming an inefficient and expensive option compared to their competition and are, on the whole, the preserve of wealthier individuals.
This doesn't necessarily negate the need for perhaps amending the regulation of Uber in the future, but suggesting that the alternative is to 'impose' black cabs on people and leave things as they are is silly.
just that the same passenger safeguards, employee protection and tax responsibilities should apply.
what Uber is please. Was just miffling about it on twitter then discovered this handy thread (that I can't be bothered to read). What is it?
Not for me.
and/ or there will be a test case regarding their employer status (or not) soon enough.
The thing that strikes me is that it seems to employ a very cynical/ sneaky algorithm based on the levels of demand and local supply from time to time. clever. but sneaky.
seems utterly pointless when local, budget taxi firms exist with free smartphone apps. and the minimum charge is £2.50, not £5. and they all have council-verified drivers and vehicles.
surely it's just for wankers in suits and people who are scared of having to converse with an actual taxi driver.
which is probably where it's strength lies here.
re: regulation and stuff: people are probably won over by a false (maybe?) sense of security when you know even before your Uber arrives what your driver looks like, their Uber rating, what car you're gonna ride in, and the number plate of the vehicle.
'having to converse to an actual taxi driver' bit.
genuinely no redeeming features of getting an uber in newcastle (more expensive, less cars than the thousands of council-reg private taxi drivers) unless you want bragging rights/are a boring person who wants to be a big lad because you can use uber or you're some sort of racist/sexist who likes screening their drivers.
or are you using black cabs?
but to be honest I always use the Metro/walk, only taken a cab a few times when it's been raining and it's late or something.
only got an Uber this time because I left it too late to get the metro before my train back to London and there happened to be a car right near me when I opened up the app. Would've been pretty screwed otherwise.
I do use it all the time in London though, can't afford to get a cab here otherwise tbh.
wannabe free market trendy wankers who are taking money away from local firms and businesses amongst the biggest employers in the region with 60+ years experience
Maybe it's like that in Newcastle but I can't imagine anyone in London being that picky/racist in their choice of cabbie.
people genuinely do go out of their way to not have a non-white, non-male driver
Lets get an Uber.
Photo comes though - No.
Next one - No.
Next one - No.
Next one - No.
Next one - No.
Let's get the bus instead.
Waits. Buss arrives.
Doors open. - FFS, I'll wait for the next one.
There's no difference between them and any other driver.
all taxi firms up here text you the car model and number plate. the drivers and cars are vetted heavily by the council and all contain a council registration number for complaints etc.
doesn't make sense up here
you're right tbh, every time I've pre-booked a taxi here (not Uber) I've been told stuff like that beforehand
I guess what I mean is Uber (here) are vying for custom from people who can't afford (or perceive that they can't) black cabs and one of the ways they can sell themselves is this perceived "safety" aspect of pre-knowledge when IN FACT it's not new or innovative at all.
we have black cabs up here too and they're twice the price of using a competitively priced private taxi firm, of which there are loads (walker, blueline/battle hill, budget and tjs/woodheads are all very reasonably priced).
plus most of them ask you which route you'd prefer/are open to being told what route to take -if you're local it can save you a quid or two per route. no ripping off.
Even if you couldn’t be bothered to book a private hire taxi hailing a black cab was generally really cheap. Can see why it’s popular in London, but would be surprised if it took off massively in places like Sheffield.
shocked they've come up here to be honest. City and Mercury have merged now so there's one huge minicab company (never have to wait more than 5 mins for a lift), and a black cab will get you a long way before breaking a tenner (to Grenoside from the city centre)
I've always found City and Mercury to be a bit unreliable, and I've used Uber a couple of times and not had a major issue. For work it's good because you get a proper receipt emailed and work have got a bit annoyed about every cab costing £10, with a healthy £4 tip built in.
They will always find a way to bodge it, and come from the opposite direction to bump your fare
Tricky issue - Uber as a company seem absolute belms, though I've found their drivers very pleasant. In addition to the tax issue they are also causing a traffic issue as they're flooding the roads with cars
Black cabs - total cunts. Tax dodgers who just want to do endless airport runs. I used to live on Wandsworth Bridge Road, and when getting a cab late at night I wouldn't even be able to say "bridge" before they'd driven off
I've reverted back to minicabs, we've a couple of decent enough firms in n16. Unless I'm doing it for work when I'll use uber as I want to minimise my own personal exposure.
Night tube will make it pretty easy for me to get home soon though so that'll be nice on the rare occasion I'm not in bed at 10pm
a couple of times I've had Uber drivers go a super silly long way for no reason but I've never been arsed to complain
the last time I got one, to Victoria at about 3am, the driver DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DRIVE THERE.
but come ON. we had to get out and walk.
EVERY time we'd tell them they were going the wrong way because of the one way system
EVERY time they'd ignore us and we'd end up walking
drivers for lecab and other services are so much more courteous and pleasant rather than the sullen angry types that populate cabs.
Maybe my most favourite mini cab firm, if such a thing can exist.
but I still use a similar service over here for my work taxis to airports (usually before 6am and so need to book in advance).
I got so fed up of some shit sack driver arriving late with 10€ already on the meter, claiming his card machine didn't work despite me having booked one with a card machine specifically (because he wanted hard cash which he wouldn't declare for tax reasons) and forcing me to bail out of the cab and find a cash point. This is inconvenient at the minimum and awful service at the extreme.
So yeah, I dislike them for what they do to standards but equally cabs in Paris are so fucking uniformly awful that it's hard to really feel like they're not getting a richly deserved kicking for years of screwing their clients. Maybe they'll both just destroy themselves through competition and we can enjoy a cab free world.
Air bnb is another subject for which similar arguments apply. Hotels are shitty and overpriced and just an unpleasant experience and definitely exploit every part of their staff,ergo I'd rather stay in someone's house or spare room, but equally just look at Berlin, Lisbon, all these places where air bnb is clearly driving up prices as dishonest get rich quick types buy specifically to use them as holiday homes.
I would much prefer that there was a reliable public transport option that could get me to and from the places that my job decides to send me, at the appropriate time. But I don't think that's anywhere round the corner.
"Unless I'm doing it for work when I'll use uber as I want to minimise my own personal exposure."
What does this mean?
with expensive cab fares, so he takes uber which is cheaper.
Sounds stupid but I fly around 1-2 times a week, red eyes and then a flight which lands late, for airport transfers that means I can easily hit 500€ of expenses in a month just for cabs, which won't get paid until end of the month.
Guess the phrase 'personal exposure' threw me a bit
I have a client that we have to get a cab to because the trains would be too much of a palaver and as the senior account person I have to stump the fare. Having £36 go out rather than £65 on a black cab makes a massive difference
in the professional world of business
Not taking a real side but still getting over a double century.
The true measure should be replies divided by characters used in op
no way he's real
that taxi drivers - without exception - are scumbags. I hope all of the uber drivers force black cab drivers and minicab drivers out of business; I hope the families of black cab drivers and minicab drivers go hungry and their children starve to death. Then, once all of the black cab drivers and minicab drivers and the families of black cab and minicab drivers are dead, I hope that at the annual uber drivers conference (which will be attended by ever uber driver) that the roof of the conference hall where its being held collapses on top of them. Have literally no sympathy for these thick, gobby, racist shitbags. Also if anyone reading this has a relative or friend who is a black cab driver or a minicab driver or an uber driver, I hope they die first. Bye!
who do you think you are, the king of Siam? Mr I-have-to-go-directly-to-the-place-right-now-just-me-on-my-own-no-one-else? An A-list star like Leo DiCaprio? Give me a break.
Airbnb and Uber will be the death of civilised society. Amazing.
Seriously guys, it's a great service. You've got to move with the times.
Definitely not a Tory babes, or a Labour MP. Soz.
gets called out for something and just flips into full trolling mode.
Thereby implying their own remarkability.
I'm not trolling either, but I guess given your expertise and remarkability, you're probably in a position to judge regardless.
But probably not new.
Sorry for interrupting. Carry on...
It's grand - Same idea but not half as dodgy as Uber with the unregulated pricing - I thought I saw somewhere on the news last year/this year where Uber hiked their prices unexpectedly in America at midnight or something. People ended up with two hundred dollar journeys for what would normally be 20/30
that's the free hand of the open market responding to supply and demand, pal.
am i doing it right
in some form of protest (including one Courtney Love is in weirdly enough).
I'd be pretty pissed about UberPop too if I was a taxi driver.
Uber are scum, but who doesn't like a sit down
Baghdad is much cleaner.
"The final problem with innovative companies like Uber is that the financial returns overwhelmingly accrue to the company’s leadership, rather than to the service providers. Whether or not that is justified, such companies’ contribution to rising income inequality – and thus to regulatory capture, media bias, and disproportionate influence in elections – cannot be ignored."
He argues that the creative destruction from Uber-like services can't be stopped, but that we need a new kind of social contract for this age. Not sure I agree with his fairly positive assessment of the service in general, but it makes a decent point. There's not a lot of use fighting these services existence in general, but making a framework that can support the workers and distribute financial gains.
you can set up a rival company that you feel better supports the workers, steal all the drivers from Uber with your more generous remuneration package, and thus force it to shut down. Everyone wins.
without child or forced labour, and generous remuneration packages and then all the bad and mean factories just shut down, heralding a new age of worker driven industrialisation?