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just shouty women telling less shouty women what they can/can't (or at least should/shouldn't) do, innit?
poking his unwanted oar in
I am merely here to help them with the humour
or have I taken the bait by actually reading the article.
represent a pretty sizeable chunk of the society. Like if 30% of Ipswich Town fans attacked a bunch of monkeys. The headline would be 'Ipswich Town fans attack monkeys'.
represent the views of the majority?
Probably 20-25%, as a rough estimate.
when the average % of all people who attack monkeys is 0.02%, if a certain sub-group have a 25% rate of monkey-attacking you'd see these actions as representative of the sub-group.
but there are so many areas where such a thought process would essentially mean endorsing some pretty problematic viewpoints.
such small differences between the sides.....at the end of the day, whats so different between an ipswich fan and a monkey?
they'd both be united in having the emnity of hartlepool fans
be good to get independence thanks
I mean a specific, one-off event, like the one in the OP.
So 30,000-odd Ipswich fans come out of a home game. 20,000 go home. 10,000 identify a bunch of monkeys and kick them and punch them and throw all sorts at them. Headline would stand.
They have slightly different view on prostitution:
'The issue arose from some students who disagreed with Smurthwaite’s support for the Nordic Model on prostitution, which decriminalises those who sell sex and criminalises the purchase of sex. The students from the college’s Feminist Society support legalisation of the sex industry.'
And security can't deal with 30% of the Society doing a picket. Wonder how they manage with a pissed up rugby team?
'Because of this difference of opinion they threatened to picket the event – causing security to pull the plug because they ‘could not guarantee the safety of students’.
Goldsmiths Feminist Society held a vote on whether they should support Smurthwaite’s appearance. Although 70 per cent voted in favour of the show going ahead, the losing minority reportedly announced they were going to form a picket line anyway, prompting security fears.'
is why the 'threat' of picketers lead to the event being cancelled. I've seen loads of picketed events go ahead without any issues. If I was being more cynical I'd almost say this is exactly the kind of headline they were looking to create.
The society broadly supported the show, some were going go picket as is their right. Security fears? Certainly isnt the feminist societies fault here, peggers. As ever it's out of touch institutions shitting themselves.
I think there is a very valid point about why 30% of a feminist society decided to actually picket an event because of what is, ultimately, a pretty minor difference in opinion. A certain section of young people do seem to be getting into a position where they're unprepared to listen to anyone that doesn't completely share their worldview down to the most minute aspects, and that's a really odd and concerning trend, cause hearing challenging views is how you get a more rounded view of the world.
that the difference between the nordic model and actual legalization is a very minor difference of opinion for one thing, I'd suggest it actually makes sex workers less safe and there's very little evidence of it working.
Additionally there's no evidence that they haven't listened to her point of view, they just disagree with it and they peacefully decided to show this, which could also be seen as showing solidarity with sex workers.
Also picketing is not the same as closing down an evident and it's not clear that was their aim it was the security forces who made that decision.
it is significant. In a wider context, to the point of basically picketing against a person being OK to perform material completely unrelated to prostitution, it's really not significant at all.
Most of the society agreed with you. But you're unhappy that a minority of people within a university society voted to hold this protest? What number would it take for us not to be having this conversation? 29%? 5%?
so entrenched in an ideology they can't even acknowledge oppo... not even opposing, *adjacent* views to theirs without having a protest of some kind. That is unhealthy. If it were two people, I wouldn't like to see that. 30% of a society, I don't like to see that. 30% is a very sizable minority.
How many people actually voted? 10?
I've already stated I wouldn't like to see, so you can imagine how little I'd like to see even three objectors.
This terrible modern phenomenon of small numbers of students who think they're right about everything. What's the world coming to?
Unfortunately what it wants to achieve ts to provide a platform for people who find prostitution morally repugnant to impose their beliefs upon the rest of society. The effects on the safety of sex workers, be they positive or negative, are immaterial to the those who extol its virtues. The important thing is that they have been seen to stamp down on immoral behaviour.
It's just as much a public registration of your concerns. In particular it seems they wanted to make clear they don't support the comedians views on sex workers. Their tolerance levels of other folk is individual of course and maybe a few of them aren't that great at processing what they disagree with. If that is the case, or if was just to protest, either way the uni wetting the bed and cancelling it sends out all the wrong messages.
Seems a bit mountains and molehills.
people actually deciding they are now live events experts and asking for usual ticket sales numbers in an effort to still blame feminists :')
they normally don't sell tickets beforehand and still get approx 50
but the phrase 'Leftie Cock Womble' has made me laugh, so hats off.
unecessarily cancel gig so they can blame feminists to try to make them look silly in public
especially in relation to the live events experts Xylo mentioned above. They're using objective information which is definitely objective. realz not feelz.
that arenot immediately understandable
why are there so many pseuds
Organisers fall on their sword because people may not like what they're doing and blame the critics for abuse and violence they haven't actually been threatened with.
The feminist society have said they did not deny her a platform, the comedy society have said:
"Despite many complaints from students about the content of Kate’s act in the past we were planning to go ahead with the gig until Kate told me 24 hours before that there was likely to be a picket with lots of students and non students outside the venue. I couldn’t verify this. Up to this point we had only sold eight tickets so I decided to pull the plug."
Now someone who sold 8 tickets at a Uni gig has a lot of publicity off the back of it.
She's been on Newsnight. She's quite well known already.
but from what I have seen, they did not set out to stop or censor the play, just to picket it. What a wonderful advert it would have been for free speech if the show had gone ahead *and* there had been protests outside? Freedom of speech all round. Instead actually they pulled out for security reasons. Sounds like a crappy "elf n safety" excuse to me.
56 of which are men desperately trying to let the internet know that they care about femenism.
It's you BTW
(ps - it's your post! http://www.meddybemps.com/thanksgiving/images/SurpriseTitle700.gif )
i appreciate that you put a hell of a lot of time into being the DiS Voice of Reason. I'm not saying i don't care at all about femenism, just that these threads always turning into sausagefests makes me laugh a bit.
slightly disarmed by it
now what do I do
it's all falling to pieces
but sorry for the insult. I've read some pretty horrible stuff online about this today and it's right in my brain.
Wasn't particularly looking for a shitstorm (and apologies for calling you 'silly' below, clearly you're perfectly rational decent sort).
2 grown adults have gotten upset over this. I'm actually shaking my head in disbelief :'D
I think this kind of attitude is terrible: the 'oh, I can't believe you bit, I can't believe you fed the troll.' Fuck that. Go and listen to Lindy West speaking on This American Life and then tell me that the occasional rise and response to these things isn't understandable. Stuff like this should not be background noise.
I live in a town where most of the workers are up for 5am to go and dig up roads/fix sewage pipes/clean the bins. The last thing I'm going to care is a few spoilt middle class brats who don't know they're fucking born.
I was merely saying that i find it a bit embarrassing to read hoards of online males claiming to understand femenism. I've said nothing bad about femenism whatsoever, and so using the word 'troll' given its wider implications, particularly with regards to the treatment of women online in the recent past, is strong to say the least. I think you're a silly person, truth be told. I think most of the people in this thread are silly people. I've not offered any sort of opinion whatsoever on what i think of femenism.
It's s_a_d's view that I find worse here - and his responses above are just pathetic - because it stops people from speaking up against the really harmful ones. There's an actual discussion to be had about men speaking up about this stuff, and I do kind of agree about those hordes of men.
put a fucking sock in it.
If I want to talk about human rights and equality I will, Im not part of a fucking cabal or anything....why the fuck has debate about feminism descended into these bizarre camps of irrelevance and distractions.
Can we all at least agree that 30% are pretty foolish
Please don't make those of us who think a lot of modern feminists speak a load of twaddle look bad by misrepresenting the story entirely.
It wasn't Goldsmith's Feminist Society who forced the cancellation of the event. It was members of the society (a minority) who chose to act like a load of spoilt brats because they subscribe to an aggressive ideology which lets them think it's okay to violently protest against the performance of someone who holds different views to them.
i dont really understand why the feminist debate about prostitution has become so polarised and irreconcilable. Like, why prostitution? Would've thought it's mainly a technical question about what approach works best to tackle abuse in sex work etc, with the secondary debate being about whether we should be fine with women being prostitutes or not (obvs massively more nuanced than that but cba). I dunno it just seems like neither 'side' is obviously right so why is there so much aggro
to be approved as an external speaker, under the education act, you need to be approved by the SU and the university. both need to research the speaker and do a sort of due diligence to make sure they can properly assess the risk (including reputational risk to the institution). student groups have got wise to this so whenever there's a speaker e.g. someone from the isreali government, george galloway etc. who they don't like, they can threaten to pose a security/safety risk. personally i think it's a very fine line and often the society/su just gives in to pressure from the student group and cancels the event.
in this case, it's apparently cause the society had only sold 8 tickets but idk if that's just to save face or what. if it was really going to go ahead, then the SU/uni would just get in extra security. happens all the time for far more controversial speakers than kate smurthwaite.
as for picketing a comedian for her stance on something which she has almost no power to actually implement or influence and isn't even a hateful/abhorrent view, fair enough but i wouldnt personally be up for that. funnily enough, we had her at our reclaim the night (not talking about anything to do with prostitution/sex work) and it went down really well.
at leicester polytechnc, our SU banned several other uni and poly students from selling their 'sexist joke' containing rag mags...(1982 was a world away)
Our rag mags WERE pc. I was on the rag comittee and me and 2 others were principally selling our rag mags........we probably sold the least rag mags of any poly/uni, we were counter-banned from selling our rag mags on any campus.....word got round that our own rag mag was not as funny as leicester uni's and loughboroughs and trent poly....etc.....
:D :( oh well, at least we had the moral highground