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If you get a tattoo you've made a conscious choice and said "here look everyone, judge me by THIS" so you can't cry foul when someone judges you by it.
Maybe. Or not. I don't know.
do not reflect the truth, then is that fair?
Just ignore me.
I liked this bit.
"A 39-year-old mother-of-three from Yorkshire with the mantra "Everything happens for a reason" on her forearm was dismissed as a waitress in 2013 following complaints from customers. "
being legitimately offended by the stupidity of that mantra
because surely they weren't thinking "Oh that woman is filled to the brim with those tattoos, gadzukes to betsy, etc." but more
"this person is clearly a massive prick with the beliefs of a brainpulped moron"
but it is not a sackable offense.
I think it's fucking awful that she got sacked for it.
but most people who work in service/hospitality can pretty much get sacked for nothing at the drop of a hat and can't do a thing about it, which is a much larger worker's rights issue than just a tattoo discrimination thing
see: those gross gumtree ads that only want female bar staff (PLEASE INCLUDE PHOTO)
so i'm not sure some sort of tattoo protection law would do an awful lot of good in this instance
I lost my job a few months back for getting angry about not getting my holiday pay.
The joy of a zero hour contract.
it is stupid.....but.....surely it is also true? (If you believe in science)
yeah but it is usually understood in the sense that there is such a thing as fate and everything will end up positively for that person, with the unstated flipside that bad things must happen to other people for 'a reason' that reason being other people aren't worthy or something, dunno thats how I've always taken it.
about handicapped people, in which case, yeah, that is something that she kind of deserves to be sacked for showing to people. But if she had the tattoo because she was expressing the more scientific, 'cause and effect' side, then she would be right to be upset by her being sacked.......
I know what you mean, the former might be presumed to be the case, unfortunately in my life I have encountered quite a lot of mistaken interpretation of my actions, which causes me to sometimes give more credence to more charitable interpretations (which probably accounts for some of my (sometimes)
annoyingly obstinately different interpretations on here)
It probably isn't meant in either sense, people just don't think things through to their logical implications, just see the positive. Probably more often used as a way of saying I've been through bad times but things are ok now or will be. Guess the science reason is tied to it, we can only see things from our timeline and look back and see how we got here, something like 'if I wasn't hit by that car I wouldn't have met my wife, everything happens for a reason' when a good number of the alternative timelines would have led to other happy outcomes, yet we feel lucky to be in the one we are even though we don't know how better it worse we would be if something had not happened.
you have some shit in your life, but you cant unwish it because otherwise you might not have the good place that you are currently..............in which case it would be a shame to get sacked for that sentiment.
she's quoting Wiley https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sleCVCT9NjE
King of Ink Land King Body Art The Extreme Ink-Ite (previously Mathew Whelan), who describes himself as the UK's most tattooed man, has led a campaign to protect the employment status of people with body modifications."
sorry pal, but i don't think the tattoos are the only reason that nobody's giving you a job
In fact you should have to present some proof of your Maori credentials before getting inked, or at least some evidence that you've actually been in a fight that didn't end with you crying.
where cultural appropriation is concerned? cause I was thinking about this the other day, and it sorta feels a bit like it could be the elephant in the room.
but I know of traditional tribal tattooists who have no problems with tattooing people outside of their culture, so long as they are respectful.
are found all over the world throughout the ages, i'm not sure they belong to any particular culture.
If people have a problem with cultural appropriation in the UK we've got bigger problems than tattoos. Our national dish is basically a bastardised version of India's after all.
me showing why I was right not to get one.........however, surely he could be considered to be British, in which case, could a celtic influenced pattern be said to be not culturally misappropriated? (outside of the fact that he is a celebrity and some might say 'not that deep'......although some might also say that it is entirely appropriate for celebrities to appropriate from wherever, as 'culture and community spanning mega celebrities' are 'pan-culture' and we expect them to just be able to 'do what they want' without consequences that non-celebrities face)
given that most people under the age of 25 now seem to have them, and so there is less stigma attached. You'd have to be a bit daft as an employer to not give someone a job solely on the basis of a tattoo these days (unless it was actually racist/etc).
particularly for people who have many/large tattoos.
Otherwise, I'm not convinced.
My tattoos are usually not visible, but when they are I get a lot of comments about me not seeming like the 'type' of person to have tattoos. I think that says something.
But I do know many people who do, from all sorts of backgrounds and in all kinds of jobs. I'm not really sure who wouldn't be the "type" to have a tattoo these days.
But it is still there.
More so outside of the big cities.
are you allowed to discriminate against ugly people when hiring? I guess you must be
Or other things that are choices?
one bloke that had TOTAL CUNT and 100% PURE HATE or something tattooed on the front and back of his torso in black
it was PURE FUCKING HATE on the front and 100% CUNT on the back
for showing body modification in a negative light, poking fun at tattooed freaks, and constantly going on about how many people regret their shitty tribal arm bands and what not.
there are certainly more bad than good.
Maybe if channel 4 showed some good tattoos people would realise tattoos can be good. There are a lot of excellent tattoo artists in the UK, but most people don't realise and simply take a picture found on pinterest to their closest studio.
no one should be discriminated against based on how they chose to look if it has no bearing on the job. having said that, I think in the past being heavily tattooed was a sign of being a badass who has deliberately chosen to mark themselves out from the mainstream, kind of a shame it has been taken over by people who want to work in offices.
There have always been 'normal' people in conservative jobs with tattoos though.
maybe but in the past you see someone with loads of tattoos you think, they're pretty cool, probably a musician, tattooist, artist or some kind of honourable grafter i.e anything but an office drone, now the office drones want in on those connotations, unconventional, rebellious, creative etc. without having to give up the cushy office job
A lot of people in the tattoo community aren't too happy about that either. I don't really care, I suspect the popularity of tattoos will decline, fashions come and go. But tattoos go more than skin deep for some people.
Fucking hell, man. :D
What is wrong with that? Just pointing out tattooed used to signify membership of certain sub cultural groups, and more popular with people in certain walks of life, often in opposition to the mainstream and that is now changing.
Dunno, I couldn't tell if you were joking or three words away from seriously using the terms 'sheeple' and 'comrade', before going off to buy another Che Guevera poster.
Semi joking, meant my point, used exaggerated contrast to illustrate it
or pop-up restaurant?
I''m not from that London.
Sorry, is this a wind-up profile?
no, but quite like the idea of picking a favourite song and getting the sheet music of the melody down my forearm
If you do, choose your tattooist very carefully, you would need someone with impeccable line work.
Now I'm thinking of getting 'everything happens for no reason'
but I would like to get something. It's all about picking something that isn't totally fucking stupid or you won't be sick of in 5 minutes.
but since then i'm more confident in my tastes and choices
I wouldn't get one for the same reason that I wouldn't buy a shirt I couldn't take off.
There's no image, design, phrase etc that I could imagine wanting to have on me forever.
I don't have a problem with people not liking/wanting tattoos. I have a problem with people who don't like tattoos judging and discriminating against those who do.
Also, the history of tattoos generally negative. I reckon it's only in the last 20ish years that we've seen a vague acceptance of it as anything but the sign of someone who actively doesn't want to be part of mainstream society.
is a good way of judging people. Same for people with attention beards, bottle tops in ears, hat wearers etc
that you couldn't claim job seekers allowance if you had tattoos past your wrist or neckline as you'd effectively made yourself unfit for various types of work. I'm sure it was and is bollocks, but I remember it seeming fairly plausible to my weed-addled brain at the time.
I could understand if an employer went for a candidate because he had no visible tattoos over one who did if they were otherwise equal. Someone's chosen to represent himself or herself in that way, if the employer doesn't feel that that presents the desired image of the company, particularly if it's a client/customer facing roll, then that's their call. Not saying I agree with it, but at the same time I don't think it should be made illegal to do so.
I'm trying to choose between ryu and popeye
as it were.
This complete thread reads like comments on an article for The Mail Online. So much for DIS being full of liberals.
I have plenty of heavily tattooed friends whose views on a lot of matters I respect, some with slightly better choices than the others, but ultimately, its something which should be reserved for amusing drunken teenage holiday mistakes, badass Japanese dudes, Russian Prisoners, Sailors and bikers. Not...Andy from Surrey with full sleeves who works in media.
Its like going round wearing band tshirts at 30, or being a "full kit" wanker.
And yes chances are it will look shit when you're old.
I would be very happy to look that awesome when i'm old.
I will still be wearing band shirts in the old peoples home
why the fuck can't I wear a band tshirt?
are you some sort of fashionista?
Most people won't care soon enough.
but no-one wants the sting
loads of nice ones too.
I don't by into the whole 'you have to get a tattoo that has meaning' bs which is peddled as a narrative thanks to reality shows - If you want to have a fucking huge back piece of a wolf and a bear fighting on top of a cliff in front of a moon, just because you think it's awesome, then yeah - I'd suggest you think it through, but whatever, fucking go for it.
I think judging someone for having 'CUNT' written on their neck or having some roses or lyrics/words on their forearm are pretty different things. I'm all for tattoo acceptance, but if you're not smart enough to know that having cunt put on your neck might have an effect on future job prospects if I need you to do anything customer facing, you're probably not smart enough to work for me.
It would be impossible to enforce. "Well yes, we were impressed by Wayne at interview stage but felt he wouldn't be a good fit for our team here. No honestly, the fact he had "WEST HAM TIL I DIE - FUCK MILWALL" tattooed across his forehead did not play a part in our decision".
where it's pretty much on the verge of being completely mundane to have them, but some of the older people amongst us, and I guess everyone outside london, are still a bit horrified by them. So there's scope for people feeling like what they've gotten done is perfectly reasonable, but others to think it's way out there.
As much as the "everything happens for a reason" woman's tattoo was hilariously shit, I don't think that's the kind of thing you should really expect to get you fired any more.
The idea that some of you guys have of other areas of the country is so weird.
It is something that I notice on here though. I COULDN'T LIVE OUTSIDE LONDON BECAUSE I WANT TO BE ABLE TO GET A TAKEAWAY AFTER 1AM.
I COULDN'T LIVE OUTSIDE LONDON BECAUSE I WANT TO GO TO A GIG.
I COULDN'T LIVE OUTSIDE LONDON BECAUSE I WANT TO EAT AT A RESTAURANT WHERE IT'S ALL DARK AND ALL THE STAFF ARE BLIND.
Actually, that last one is probably valid. You can keep that.
yet get away with it.
(personally I'd happily live in a bunch of other places but it'd mean changing industries and I am very lazy).
it's just bookies and poundshops. The people who work in the poundshops spend all their pay in the bookies. It's a functioning economy.
or if they work somewhere then get a massive skull on their face, but if someone had one age 18, then they cannot get a job due to it at 45, that doesn't really seem fair. In theory you could look at it in the same way as any "disfigurement".
My parents' generation hate tattoos, but I don't know anyone of mine who gives a shit. I doubt it will matter in a few years.
I have nearly a whole sleeve and I'm working on a second. I've personally never had issues finding work. I understand certain jobs aren't going to be open to me because of them but thats fine by me. I knew exactly what I was letting myself in for when I got them and I'm not going to go crying to anyone if they refuse to give me a job because of them.
That said, I do hope that as tattoos become more popular certain industries will become more open to hiring tattooed people, it's so bloody common now it's kind of ridiculous to presume people with tattoos all conform to a set of very negative stereotypes.
Another thing - kids need to stop tattooing their necks and hands so bloody much. I've seen so many (guys mostly) tattooing their hands/necks/faces before they've even covered their arms/legs/chest. It's really silly.
except i only have one, tshirt covered tattoo
I run away if I see you coming.
I think we've reached peak tattoo.
I think there are still a lot of people who may want to get tattooed but won't because of the social stigma surrounding it.
That said, if my mum gets tattooed we've peaked.
- Old school hardnuts/sailors (I don't think that these people will ever shake off the social stigma)
- the much-mocked chinese writing ones that have been nastily ridiculed as 'tramp-stamps'
- Hipsters with full-sleeve tattoos, working in a coffee shop/bike repair place. This is the group most likely to help shift the social stigma around it, but only if they continue to get tattoos, and I don't think that they are in 2014. 2012, maybe, but, like beards, this look is becoming less popular.
There is a fourth archetype, I suppose, and that's professional footballers. Again, I don't think that it'll persist for more than a couple of years as a trend, even if the result of it will be visible for the remainder of the players' careers on the pitch.
+ gym goers with tribal tattoos
Have to say I think you're incredibly wrong about 'this look is becoming less popular' I'd say it's as prevalent as before.
so the number of tattoos is not going to decline, but the number of people getting tattoos who might help to shift the stigma (your stereotypical young urban middle class types - because the other types are - unfortunately - looked down upon) is going down, I think, or certainly amongst those in London, anyway.
that tattoos are going back out of fashion.
I don't fit into any of your categories though.
What about the rock/metal types?
Nah , your average suburban metaller/goth/punk aren't hardnuts, if anything closer to geeky, not hip enough for hipster.
I was talking about the archetypes that society has created around tattoo wearers and whether or not they would be able to challenge the social stigma around them. Suburban metaller/goths/punks are not going to be able to do that. They are still lumped in with the first group by society and are feared for that.
I really don't think there are any "archetypal tattoo gettters" these days. It really isn't special or controversial - people chose to get tattoos for so many different reasons that completely transcend the typical "hardman trying to look tough / hipster trying to look cool" stereotypes. I mean, when Samantha Cameron and David Dimbleby are walking around with tattoos it's hard to claim you're part of some special little snowflake club.
I think as a nation most of us have come to the conclusion that tattoos really aren't anything special or ~*edgy*~ at the end of the day it's a drawing on someones body, I don't see why its such a point of contention with so many people. You either like them or you don't, but to make presumptions on someones character based on something as arbitrary as a tattoo seems a tad silly to me.
It's a deliberate choice by someone to get a body modification that they think expresses their character, or a part of their character.
what about someone who just gets something like a flash because 'fuck it, I think it looks cool'?
Also with them being more common, more a part of celebrity culture and more towards a fashion thing than an extension of self, then it would be pretty arbitrary.
I mean, it seems arbitrary to me because;
a) I have lost count of the number of tattoos I have
b) My choices of tattoos aren't super deliberate. I have one artists I always go to who is also a good friend. I've been in plenty of times and given him free reign to fill in little gaps with whatever he wants (within reason) A lot of it is not necessarily about expressing an element of my character, I'm more than happy to admit many of them are purely aesthetic. At the end of the day he's an artist I admire and the only way I can "collect" his art is to have it tattooed on me.
I just think tattoo related stereotypes become a bit useless when they're so common and existent in nearly every level of society.
Just that the vast majority of tattoos are rank. andf now that the craze of the last ten yeasrs is dying away, people can stop pretending to admire the emperor's New clothes and can actually point and laugh at the emperor's hideous and comical nudity.
I have never seen a tattoo I like. I have become good at lying to friends who ask me for an opinion on theirs, becasue how can you say- i think it's the foulest most ridiculous thing I've ever seen! Why the actual fuck have you done that to your lovely arm/ tits/ leg/ boobs/ bak! Why?! Don't you eralise that in ten years this is oging ot fade and sage and you're going to be spendingh every last penny you have on tattoo removal (which btw will competlely fuck your skin!) But I can't say what i really mean because you've already gone ahead and had it done you fucking twerp!
it's not too expensive. I reckon I'll have spent maybe £80-100 by the time I've done.
Though I guess I sleeve would cost A BOMB. And knack.
Has virtually all of her leg covered. and they aint dainty wee legs. naturally she now hates her humingbird surrounded by a Jingle and has nghtmares abouty it pecking her but she can't afford ot get it off.
I wouldn't rule out getting a small on some day somewhere discreet, but I've just never felt strongly enough about any kind of pictorial symbolism to have it permanently etched on me.
fair play to those that do I guess.
We didn't really discuss the pictorial symbolism that much
to atone for the worst thread ever
I find it incredibly weird that people would ask someone to hurt them. "Oh yeah, if you're going to sew up that big gash on my leg don't bother with anaesthetic. I really enjoy being brutally hurt".
YOU'RE why people GET tattoos.
I have never heard any of my tattoo'd friends, nor have I ever asked other people what they think of our tattoos. Probably says a lot about the different reasons people get them...
'Don't you eralise that in ten years this is oging ot fade and sage and you're going to be spendingh every last penny you have on tattoo removal'
Alright grandma! ;)
Not something that easy to do if you're covered in ink, it looks so awful older skin.
Obviously it massively depending on how good the original work was anyway and how you look after it, but I know people who are 60+ with tattoos and still love them and they still look good - better than a lot of the shit I see that's a few months old.
Yeah but what you think doesn't matter if the person getting it done doesn't think the same. Most people I know with tattooed see it as a massively positive thing, like some kind of therapy almost, somehow taking control if their lives. Can't imagine them regretting it. And the looking bad when older is over stated.
Weak people sicken me.
yeah, imagine it is quite a symbolic and meaningful thing for some people
on my inner forearms i think
choosing something is teh tricky bit - maybe to mark the occassion when / if i have a baby
Don't do it.
I didn't mean don't have children. Have all the children the good lord blesses you with, I'm sure you'll be a great (and prudent) dad.
Just don't do the tattoo birthdate thing.
i reckon i'll still like the baby in a few years time
I'm beating around the bush because if I say it I'll get flamed (probably rightly) for sounding like a really classist c-word.
and tacky. it's not like youre going to forget your own kid's birthday, is it?
That's a brilliant analogy.
But there are so many things out there that are more aesthetically pleasing than a numerical date (if thats what you're thinking.) Plus good stand alone script is SO hard to get right in terms of matching with the natural contours of the body. So many text tattoos end up looking wonky or just "stamped on." But fuck it, you don't have to listen to me it's your choice. There are far greater injustices in this world than poorly executed tattoos.
lotta judgement getting thrown around this thread
whereas i was more thinking of taking inspiration from this kind of thing
Something inspired by the second one could be super fucking cool though.
It's a great idea as long as it's not taken too far. I mean neck and face tattoos are a bit much but not giving someone a job because they've got a half sleeve is stupid.
with too many characters in the title.
Nest, were you the person who had the mummified bird tattoo?
It's absolutely awesome, from what I remember.
and thankyou :)
and when you scan it takes you to a folder of my dick pics
that case in Milton Keynes sounded like proper nonsense though and makes me wonder if it doesn't potentially expose a greater issue with corporate policy/personal choices.
whether better design and placement choices would be made. Particularly for those under 21. I know the me of now would have liked the teenage me to have not rushed it. (not in a big regret way, just in a could have done better way)
I certainly don't think judgement purely lies in the older generation, as many replies in the tread suggest there's something of a more youthfull (middle class, white, indie bedwetter) reaction against the growth of tattoo culture.
more power to anyone who wants one though
except the OP, he sounds really wet and whiny. he should be banned from tattoos for interrupting my equilibrium
First you caused the Tories and now this
across my arms and chest