it's a thing.
sadly, as with national pride, non-minority groups aren't really allowed to voice pride without a small, vocal number of people using the opportunity of a pedestal to ruin it for everyone else.
on the face of it, though, a good thing...but it probably won't be presented as such, either externally by others, including the media, or internally by the spokespeople who have their own agendas.
''The celebration of one's heterosexuality. It is not a bigoted or intolerant thing to proclaim...''
''...There is nothing right with being homosexual, there is nothing right with being bisexual, and there is nothing wrong with being heterosexual''
but maybe there's a point at the root of it in that sexuality isn't a choice and given that is neither right nor wrong. If the words were reversed there and the writer was saying that there's nothing wrong with being homosexual and nothing right about being heterosexual people would probably understand what you'd hope is the point he's trying to make.
'Modern society has come to look down upon the heterosexual mainstream as being unwilling to accept the homosexuals who have chosen to be different'
...but to be honest this goes back to the point i was making in my initial post, really, in that straight pride could and probably should be a thing, but it won't be, for several reasons, firstly because majority groups aren't really allowed to be proud or don't feel the need to fight their corner, but also because you'll always get a visible, right-wing element.
and it probably is. Everyone has a right to be proud of their sexuality, but using it to campaign against people of other sexual orientations sort of defeats the whole point.
the point of pride was never just 'everyone should be proud of their sexuality', it was specifically a reaction against a culture of shame and secrecy and invisibility. 'pride' not because pride is an inherently valuable sentiment that everyone should affirm about every aspect of their identity, but because pride is the opposite of shame. do you know any closeted straight people?
how do you know they're straight?!?!?!
is considered shameful?
in wider society, probably not so much.
closeted straight croatian mate?
you know how every day you live your life with no shame of the fact that you are straight?
she's actually a broadsheet-famous home cook. i was reading some of her recipes recently. very good they were, too.
with his little bowler hat and shit; he's proud of his flour empire
Thanks alot GUYS
"There is nothing right with being homosexual, there is nothing right with being bisexual, and there is nothing wrong with being heterosexual and being proud to be of natural orientation. . .If it is equality that we are aiming for"
They get there and realise that they're all just a bunch of mokers and there's not one woman among them.
but you typify so well sort of person that might be into this: super earnest, probably really nice, not hateful, but really confused.
So much so that I'm inclined to use your name as shorthand.
for example, "I had a chat with X the other day about why there should probably be a Music of White Origin awards to complement the MOBOs. I'd had a few drinks and I found myself getting pretty heated about it. In the sober light of day I realised I had been mokering away the whole time, I'm so embarrassed"
Been proud of convincing particular women to be actively heterosexual with me a few times though. Does that count?
sounds a bit nicer than those Sicilian chaps, bet they have nicer scatter cushions too.
Someone prove to me this site isn't a joke though please.
Does that make them technophiles?
WHAT HAVE THE GAYS GOT? OH THEY'VE GOT SOME PRIDE THING WHICH WE HAVE'NT. WE WANT. THAT. I WANT THAT VAGUELY DEFINED EMOTION I WANT THAT. AND WHY CAN'T I WEAR MY CRUCIFIX? AND WHY DON'T WOMEN HOLD DOORS OPEN FOR ME.
I fucking detest these self-pitying cunts. Does life not present enough obstacles that you have to have make up shit. ARRGGGHHHHHHH.
we have to make ourselves feel special and different by perceiving ourselves as victims
he's been after the people complaining about Channel 4 today.
I've never been but I know straight people who go and I've always had the impression that if I fancied going then I wouldn't be made to feel unwelcome.
If there was a straight person who was keen to celebrate their sexuality - and genuinely had no prejudices - I don't get why they wouldn't just pop along and join in the party rather than creating a new thing.
but would I be right in thinking that that's the reason it tends to be referred to as just Pride now?
but I like to think of it as a massive general opening up of the whole thing. Crucially in the name of equality, which renders these Straight Pride folks' argument completely irrelevant.
It's no longer 'gay' pride because not all LGBT and queer people are gay. Pretty simple.
and tiramisu ends up typing out huge 400-word paragraphs?
No offence but if people are gonna be hitting out with shit like right i'm just totally speculating here but I think pride could possibly also cover straight people...you'd do well to just fuck off for a bit.
i'll punch you in the groin.
but meant to say that I felt it could be seen as part of a wider opening of the whole dialogue, so to speak.
but that the amorphous entity that is mainstream culture is starting to become a more diverse thing, with LGBT values increasingly becoming a part of what mainstream culture can be said to be and to represent
Mb then pondered that this (?) might be why it's now just 'pride'
Tgwnu then said he thought it was partly that [amongst other things]
It being called pride is not because its now more 'welcoming' to straight people, more open to dialogue etc. why would they have to erase the word gay for that reason? it literally is just because 'gay pride' is so problematic and 'pride' isn't exclusionary.
1) that wasn't strictly my point. More that if a straight person wants equal rights for straight people and LGBT people (which the people who founded the website are already trying to do), a march already exists that strives for that so there's no real need to create one unless you are actually being prejudiced.
2) I didn't read that strictly as MB's point either - I read it as he says above.
3) I'm well aware the main reason for the name change is more the second part of what I said rather than the bit I'm agreeing with MB on. I just don't think it's necessarily or helpful to go "You're wrong". I'm a qualified teacher - going "that's a good point but have you also considered x?" is pretty much what I get paid to do.
Im very aware of how little these things are discussed on the boards so i think it's important to clear up points where people are confused/wrong. Thinking that 'gay pride' was changed to 'pride' to in some way accommodate straight people (even in a positive way, for improved dialogue) isn't correct.
I still disagree with you because I value the autonomy of pride and think its absolutely fundamental to its aim. Therefor it just simply does not exist as a catch-all event for equality.
(Although I would say that's what the Pride website pretty much markets it as.)
Clearly the idea of straight people needing to march for straight pride in the name of equality is farcical and the only way straight people who wanted to promote equality could possibly treat Pride is as something where they acted as 'allies' in order to promote increased equality of rights for LGBT people. I'm just trying to highlight the inherent contradiction in the Straight Pride website.
And the fact that, in your view, somewhere exists now to do that (pride):
'If there was a straight person who was keen to celebrate their sexuality - and genuinely had no prejudices - I don't get why they wouldn't just pop along and join in the party rather than creating a new thing.'
That's definitely not going to pride as an 'ally'.
Genuinely not trying to have a go here and I know my understanding of pride isn't the same as everyone's and its become a very commercial affair. DannyDyer will remember getting booked last year (only to be pulled after people threatened boycott). even if you take out the political protest element you're left with loads of drunk, happy people who for one day a year get to be completely out and surrounded by other LGBT people (I think if you're not totally out its ok to march).
I don't necessarily think that it has to involve making any public statements or proclamations - just enjoying being amongst other people and reflecting who you are and who you fancy the diverse range of lifestyles that other people also enjoy.
As a general rule for straight people, society tends not to put you into places where you find the opportunity/need to reflect on your sexuality, how that affects you as a person, how you feel about that and how it shapes your world.
Obviously being in a place where you can more clearly be surrounded by others whose sexuality differs from yours* gives you scope to reflect on that and celebrate who you are on a personal level. That doesn't mean you need to make any bold proclamations of your heterosexuality or try to claim the event for yourself. But my point really is that, if you're genuinely straight, unprejudiced and keen to encourage equality, there's no logical reason why you'd need to do that anyway.
*I'd argue everyone's sexuality differs to other people's to some extent and that the labels we stick on ourselves aren't necessarily the whole story but obviously that's an entirely separate matter.
but i can give it a go if you want
Unless you mean going to a fringe even or something. And definitely as an ally to Lgbt people not someone there to just celebrate being straight and cis! Cause like, uh everything else to some degree is a celebration of straightness.
Pride is a massive subject of contention but for those who see pride as a protest (which it is) it's quite important that its led by those who actually self-define particularly for the proper march bit.
which is what the people running this Straight Pride thing are claiming to do - although my point is that they obviously aren't.
but LGBT pride (you called it gay pride btw) isn't just a street party. For straight people to go along and act like its for them too kinda goes against the very reason people are marching. Not trying to be overly critical cause obvs your point was one totally supportive of LGBT rights but basically straight people marching at pride is at best a bit touristy, at worst undermining the claims/voices of a lot of LGBT people.
(The official site calls it Community Pride rather than LGBT Pride incidentally. And some of the floats that run aren't from LGBT organisations per se, although I'd presume they still do in solidarity.)
But yeah - I'm not suggesting it's a good idea for straight people to turn up at Pride (gonna stick to that 'cos it's easier to avoid confusion) and start marching to express that they're in favour of equality. I'm just saying that, if we were to accept the claims of the founders of the straight pride website at value - i.e. that they're proud of their sexuality and unprejudiced - then I can't really see the logic as to why it'd be necessary to create a separate event.
Obviously this is a moot point as the entire thing is illogical, contradictory, isn't really designed by people in favour of equality and there's no rational need for straight pride in any case. I was more pointing out the fallacy of their logic rather than trying to make a practical suggestion.
But in all their garbled bigotry they obviously resent the autonomy that the LGBT movement claims for itself. Their argument would, presumably, be that they're not allowed to march at the pride march.
What I've said is yeah of course they shouldn't be allowed to because pride is a political event about inequality and not simply an exercise to make everyone feel great about their sexuality. a straight contingent at pride would be co-opting (and compromising the efficacy of) actual liberation politics.
But a straight person who was genuinely in favour of equality probably wouldn't feel the need to be politically active at Pride. It'd be enough to stand, watch and show solidarity.
except that it does seem to be for quite a lot of people - the gay people I know just go along cos it's an excuse to get drunk and party. If that's the case then it kind of weakens the argument that LGBT Pride is an exclusively political thing, and if it's not that then why shouldn't straight people be allowed to join in?
Whilst I sympathise with what DD's saying but my impression is Pride is nowadays viewed by the majority of people as a celebration of sexuality, rather than a political protest. I'm not necessarily sure that's a good thing and arguably it does lead to the protest aspect (which is very important) getting lost amongst the drinking, partying and corporate sponsorship but I'm not convinced it is largely treated as a political event, even if perhaps it should be.
probably defeats the purpose of it too, i think.
1. whether someone is indeed 'dictating to others' or just arguing for or defending one of many possible positions
2. whether someone self-defines.
3. which pride you're talking about and it's governance structure if any. Manchester pride for example is a charity with defined objects and a board who interpret them.
Argue for straight people joining in at pride if that's what you want mate.
I was just responding to your general focus on the political aspects of Pride, when from my experiences the general focus is on the celebration aspects.
really not sure about that. I can see that most things might be an enacting or living-out of straightness, but you've got to be actively doing more than that for it to be a celebration.
Will really make heterosexual pride a massive deal in the world.
at the hands of those people who have oppressed us for so long by living differently and having the gaul to want the same rights as me. #somethingsgottochange #legalisestraightcivilpartnerships #whyisntthereawhitehistorymonthoratleastadaytohonourdeslynamorsomeonelikethat
Is a little catchier. Dont let me oppress you though man. Hate you to go moker all over our arses
I'm straight, it's just a thing, I don't feel proud abut it any more than, I dunno, having blue eyes (actually I am proud of that, they're pretty dreamy).
Gay pride is about celebrating something that was illegal and is still looked down on from certain areas of society.
I was pretty much done when I read
"unwilling to accept the homosexuals who have chosen to be different"
surely its a pisstake?
If only we could turn back time.
do any of DIS's hot gay indie kids want their cock sucked?
is so full of shit. Homosexuals have more rights than any other?. Just reads like shit trolling
Hospital for healthy people
Soup kitchen for the rich
good name for something tbh, deserves to be used
fact that the creators of the organisation sound like very plain and extremely simple morons.
Bunch of absolute cunts.
JUSTICE FOR HETEROS! BUT ONLY IF WE CAN USE LGBT DISCOURSE TO ACHIEVE IT!
Wankers. Utter wankers.
here's a snippet from PAUL - 34
Paul 34 "I came out to my wife and family at #glastonbury, I told them that I was #Straight they were so proud I was normal" #StraightPride
I can only imagine how that conversation with his WIFE might have gone.
"Hearing some great stories from brave people who we have encouraged to come out to friends & family as Straight. #StraightPride''
is this actually a joke?
seems a little dumb
They probably think the Top Gear banter is the epitome of sophisticated wit.
"Let us know if you are thinking about coming out of the closet finally and letting everyone know that you are #Straight and proud of it.''
you've just dropped to slightly above CG and just below Lucien on my Cool-O-Meter.
and stupid, ignorant people are funny.
I'm not laughing with them.
pushed you back up again. (it's a manual keep meaning to get one of those fancy automatic Cool-O-Meters)
that's gotta hurt.
Michael Foot's History of Sexuality vol 1 has been forever lost in the ether :(
they try to be excellant (on their own terms)
'proud of being homophobic'
and then 'proud to be employed'
and I'm proud.
So ... you're saying you want those rights? This is a campaign for the right to dress ridiculously?
*Takes off clown shoes, hot pants and diving bell helmet*
Instead of being an oppressed heterosexual.
"Straight Pride, we believe are normal everyday people, dressed normally, walking and behaving normally, to raise awareness of being straight, and being PROUD to be heterosexual."
WALK AND BEHAVE NORMALLY
I specifically deleted his branch because it was such a big troll shit.
FUCK THE FASCIST REGIME
I'm sure straightpride are issuing him martyrdom as you read this.