Your are viewing a read-only archive of the old DiS boards. Please hit the Community button above to engage with the DiS !
"Lord Young said: 'I have experienced every recession since 1955 and I have never known a recession where employment goes up and at a time when the population is growing" is a fair point to raise, even if it might not be exactly true.
He's questioning if the measurements of economy are correct or apt.
*In November 2010, Lord Young resigned as the Prime Minister’s business adviser after telling The Daily Telegraph in an interview that “the vast majority of people in the country today had never had it so good” because a drop in interest rates since the start of “this so-called recession” had left them with more spending money.*
the guy's a nut. And I fucking h-a-t-e this government but it's just fair enough to raise that question.
for example you could sack 1,000 people from their full time jobs earning £20,000 a year
and then employ 1,200 people part-time at £11,000 a year
unemployment goes up!
productivity goes down - bad for the GDP (& for the company incidentally)
tax reciepts go down - bad for the GDP
anxiety and stress and thus sick leave goes up! - bad for everyone
scale it all up
cut back essential services for those employed on the margins leaving no one with any disposable income
It's all so obvious and simple to sort out!
great soundbite that
truly there is no shortage of out-of-touch shithead peers in the Tory party
what a ludicrous country this is sometimes.
people weren't queueing for iphone5s during the last recession!
iPhone contracts are credit agreements by another name
I'm working just off Commercial Street / Whitechapel road and within a square kilometre, there must be at least 20 multi MULTI million pound - probably bordering on billion pound structures being built.
Everywhere you look in East London - literally everywhere, there are tower cranes and construction sites. And they're all privately funded.
Somebody has some money.
(Who, incidentally, the ones that I'm working with are probably earning 65k a year, if not more)
I was talking about the people fundung the builds.
Also worth noting that most of them are residential.
Everywhere else in the country is very flat.
the problem with the economy as it currently stands is wealth disparity and debt/credit
the vast majority of people (the 99% if you like) are living like the slaves of the wealthy (to an extent)
problem is that when profits are private and losses are public there's no money for ordinary folk after a financial crisis to lead a consumer recovery - plus the fear people have over their work/money situation is leveraged by corporations to increase profit so the cash trickles up to the top and the whole thing becomes more oppressive and narrowed
you are giving the example of The City - one of the areas of the most highly concentrated wealth in the world
there's a lot of things being built at the moment, construction workers are very highly paid and you need a lot of them to build things, so therefore this is a good thing - for construction workers, anyway.
And, isn't construction / building one of the first key indicators that things are improving?
there's quite a big difference between large infrastructure investment that gives long term employment & improvement and can only really be done with Government involvement (Grants, loans, loan guarantees etc.)
Private companies buying a plot, sinking money into luxury housing, employing foreign subcontractors on short term contracts that undercut local union rates and then siphoning all the tax into an offshore account
The only time that you'll get foreign sub-contractors (principle contractors) is to build specialised civil works, like The Wembley stadium (Australian company built this) and the 2nd Severn Crossing (French company), but even so, 99.99% of their labour is English. Why would they pay for their own workers to live in digs, when they can employ people that live nearby?
I'm just saying that (and okay, I don't know about other sectors) a lot of people are needed to build these structures, and a lot of the buildings are in their starting stages - a lot of people being employed for a lot more years is a good thing, right? Regardless of who's buying the apartments.
your sample is too localised to be representative I think
a hell of a lot better than it was 2 or 3 years ago *in London*.
Even if this is an isolated case, it's still better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.
Okay, I'm going to sneak out of this thread now..
Perhaps more Brits should move over there. Especially the ones who can work from home/over the internet.
these days you're lucky (if that's the right word) to see 2
construction has definitely slowed/ stoped in this city centre
an office building that was finished two years ago still has empty floors in it
And more specifically, the City. Always fairly well insulated from the real world.
In Swindon and Bristol specifically.
All Construction (£ million)
Region 2009 2010 2011 2012 ytd
East Midlands 1,639 1,954 2,032 1,748
East of England 2,041 2,834 3,032 2,340
London 4,866 6,353 7,812 6,323
North East 1,229 1,371 1,554 1,256
North West 3,483 3,639 3,760 2,861
Northern Ireland1,121 988 1,075 773
Scotland 3,284 4,107 4,252 3,531
South East 3,859 3,493 4,866 3,826
South West 2,623 2,638 3,408 3,250
Wales 1,157 1,549 1,580 1,592
West Midlands 2,187 2,818 3,170 2,309
Yorkshire 2,052 2,520 2,696 2,173
how using London as an example is absolutely bogus as if you add up everything being built in North West, the North East and Yorkshire then you get roughly the same figure.
now do as I say no excuses, how are we meant to compare like for like otherwise?
Plus he was in thatchers government.
He is obviously just a looney incompetent
Is there fuck a recession
You can complain that it's all a problem with confidence and stuff but whose bloody idea was it to base the whole economy on that sort of nonsense anyway? It was some other Tory jerk probably I don't know I'm not a historian.
The whole idea of motivating those who are supposedly stuck in the doldrums to show more appetite in fighting this adversity is flawed. Stable working positions aren't everywhere right now, the effect of raising somebody's spirit before revealing their increased diligence is for nothing is very damaging.
It reminds me of that program a few months ago where a woman "trained" young, unemployed people to be more employable. The only upshot of her success would be to put her protege into work ahead of some other unlucky souls not featured on her show.
creeping over my castle walls either.
everyone must be just fine.
People really get their heads down, work hard, train in something, offer their time for free, hey even busk for a suit if they don't own one. This would work for them, but it couldn't work for everyone. For every person who makes it (a la Pursuit of Happyness) there are/would be tens who don't despite all that. With millions unemployed and few jobs and few opportunities for new businesses, it is physically impossible.
I really wish someone would take cunts like this on a tour of the poorest parts of the country at knife point.
It's your fault for putting them in power. Even if you didn't vote for them. You all created a culture of I'm All Right Jack materialism by refusing to let people in your sixth form common room unless they wore winklepickers exactly like Pete Doherty, as if they didn't they is not normal innit.
No matter what they say in their manifesto.
that grew when we are all at sixth form.
Everything sinful in the Western world can be traced back to the year 2006.
The invention of WAGS, George Galloway's cat impression, Voodoo Child by Rogue Traders..
Even I was getting bored by my own posts.
It's rambing bollocks.
I think that what you are trying to identify here is 'marketing advertising'
as far as Im concerned "you are in it as well"
(thinly veiled my position is more extreme than yours.....no matter how hard you try)
I know you are probably the most sincere poster on here, but on this front I was only kidding to blow raspberries at those who despise me on this forum (and I'm sure you don't, I'm eternally grateful to you for your feedback on the NME 100 thread.)
as I saw you using a turn of phrase I sometimes do on here.....i.e. "you all" I sometimes even say "you humans" ;D