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Just been watching the pictures on BBC News. Massive devastation. This looks horrific.
I imagine the tsunami is going to be apocalyptic.
Except for the flooded areas, it looks as though their building codes worked, I mean, to the extent that it doesn't look like the same kind of devestation that Haiti experienced.
But for those areas that got hit by the tsunami, uhm, not good. ...oh shit, I'm now watching this flood water roll through this town...it's like a Hollywood disaster movie...oh, shit...
You're in SF, aren't you?
It looks pretty damn fucked up :(
the reports of '3 dead' make it sound far less serious than it looks
i'm using mobile internet to try and get updates and keep crashing every 10 seconds
And that fire, Christ.
and the news says it'd be 10 hours before anything got here...but Hawaii is now be upgraded to a tsunami "watch", which presumably means to move to higher ground.
i'm not sure if its because of other recent events or not, but this is scaring me a lot more than these incidents usually do.
i'm not sure if tokyo is that badly affected in regards to casualties yet though. someone wrote about having to turn off the power on facebook, so if he's going on facebook i'd presume it's not been as bad as it could have been. i'm yet to really check the news though.
One of them posted that public transport is down, as are heating and electricity supplies, but mobile internet is still working and damage isn't too severe. Some injuries from things falling, a few fires, but not like buildings falling down all over the place.
My other friend clicked attending on a gig event happening in London in May when she gets back, so she's presumably fine and not too fazed by the whole thing.
The major damage is up north - but you can tell where the western news organisations have their offices because everything's being talked about from a Tokyo perspective...
And Tokyo is a fair way away. I suspect it's the remote Coastal fishing towns where the damage has been done.
8.9 on the MMS indicates an earthquake 1000 times more powerful than the Christchurch one, which was 6.9. Crikey.
but still, pretty terrifying.
whatever that means...
Didnt actually read the artical first. Deserved that
That should have warned you it was bad.
Call of the dogs
I think that's what is known as ''barking''
I really am the worst kind of scum
Thats the last time i get a ticket from Twitter
only about 40% of my comments are crass funnies
You just tend to the air out of pompous situations. A lot.
*40% crass of 2% are funnies.
Hope its not as bad as it looks.
Mobile networks totally jammed, everyone having to resort to payphones to let loved ones know they are safe, not sure on the state of our building, the stairs were cracking as we were leaving ...
Thanks everyone, we are OK, but that earthquake was one of the scariest moments of my life!! We were in a restaurant on the 9th floor of a department store. It started swaying so much. I was the first to duck under the table (with baby Emily), soon after everyone did the same. The swaying was so strong you couldn't stand. Dishes went flying off the tables, and I could hear dishes breaking in the kitchen. One of the pipes in the kitchen burst, so the restaurant started flooding and one of the cooks had a panic attack; she was shaking & crying. I could totally understand how she felt because the whole time we were hiding under the table, I couldn't get images of the Christchurch earthquake out of my head, and I really thought we might die. But after the swaying stopped, we just evacuated the building via the stairs, and walked home (trains were stopped and the line for the taxi was too long). I'm home now, and only a few things got knocked over by the quake, but there are still aftershocks. I'm so grateful that we are all OK. My thoughts and prayers go out to those people who are closer to the center of the quake
looking at the news now.this is totally fucked!
terrifying stuff. The water/mud/debris was surging inland destroying everything in it's path. There was a building in amongst it being swept along on fire.
the epicentre was relatively shallow, which is a very bad thing.
I'm sure I read somewhere this morning that the strongest earthquake on record was 9.5.... so this is up there as one of the worst on record.
a lot of people in Tokyo are still unaware of the damage done elsewhere.
Boxing day Tsunami /Hurricaine Katrina/ Cyclone Yasi/ Christchurch Earthquake/ Brazilian Mudslides/Floods/ Queensland Floods/Pakistan Floods/ Haiti.... the list is getting longer and the events closer together .....anyone thinking the Mayan's may well of had a point??
that was a genuine post...admittedly the Kev Costner Waterworld refrence furthur down is slightly crass but taking note that These events are happening with more regularity and on a bigger scale is a true fact...one which would point towards a major shift in the planets topography as we know it......It has happened before why cant it happen during our time?
Your not convinced that Natural disasters are not getting any more frequent or ferocious in the last 10 yrs
As well predict the health of a person by how ill they've been in the last month. We're talking about the workings of a planet that's been here for 4,500 million years.
But weren't the dinosaurs wiped out by some kind of huge shift in the planet's stability causing all kinds of apocalyptic carnage?
Again, I don't know what I'm talking about here - I did a multimedia production degree for crying out loud.
there you go. They didn't teach us that in our film lectures, the cunts.
I get about 1 question right in an entire series of University Challenge so don't come the thickie with a thickie!
I could believe weather-based disasters are incresing in freqency, but you're going to need to cite evidence for what you're claiming.
Obviously tectonic plate-based disasters aren't.
I just thought I'd slip some supporting evidence in there as he was getting ridiculed for suggesting that the frequency of natural disasters is increasing, which the research suggests is the case.
I am genuinely scared.
i read a book about it recently (fictional but still very informative), but i forget what its called.
but at the end of the day nature is in control of us.
Horrible footage on the TV. Thoughts with those people.
See that car desperately trying to get away from the oncoming Tsunami. Horrifying. Wonder if they made it...
...that cunt is a visionary.
within the Pacific region and on the coast I think Im allowed to try and make light of this...you can sit in your comfy office in London and say what you like ..... According to CNN I'm looking at maybe coming face to face with a Tsunami WITHIN THE NEXT 5 HRS!!!!...so how about you Fuck Off!!
You're coming off as desperate to climb on your high horse.
Don't tell me that you don't think his initial comment, posted without any of the context he scrabbled to find in the latter one, isn't inappropriate.
I thought it was vaguely amusing.
He scrabbled to find the context did he? I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion - seemed to me he just responded to your post... unless you have surveillance on him and you saw him frantically typing and re-typing his response - sweating into his keyboard was he?
If I was over in a region potentially affected by this it is exactly the sort of joke I would make. We are all doomed - Kevin Kostner was right!
What I find offensive is that someone just told me that this is all happening because God is angry with people.
This is now the worst bit of this thread.
you pub shitting freak!
I am not a freak Mr. Mother Nature Is Coming For Us And She's MAAAAAD!!!
''People take shits in pub toilets every day.''
Bit of a sweeping statement that. Can you back it up with an ACTUAL evidence?
GET OVER IT
and I'll do my best.
he was in the region.
There is a place for you and Deadwrong on my post apocalyptic pedlo...Winds and tides prevailing I should up your way within the next year...I only hope I get to drift past Theo and Marckee clinging desperately to the top of Nelsons Column...i will probably throw stones at them.
I can't help feeling that it is mother earth fighting back against all the parasitic damage humans are doing to her... in the same way if we get infections we kill them with anti-biotics.
I realise I have no basis for this and it sounds like a bad plot to a hollywood movie...but still.
Or are we just more urbanised/populated and more connected than ever right now? So natural disasters on the other side of the world that, 100 years ago, would have flooded x-amount of fields and a few small villages now ends up wiping out a whole city. And what 100 years ago would have made a couple of paragraphs of text on page 4 of the newspapers a few days later, is now streamed as live video to everyone else on the planet.
[This is not a climate change denial post, but it's probably a 2012 apocalypse denial post]
"Is 'mother earth fighting back'? Or are we just more urbanised/populated and more connected than ever right now?"
Well, that would be why mother earth is fighting back wouldn't it? If you believed such things.
I'm pretty sure it's an over active imagination fueled by films and books that makes me think like that.
Just hold onto your mandala, pull your tie-die robes closer in around you and meditate while stroking your beard until it all feels better.
I'm out of joss sticks, so how the fuck am I supposed to meditate properly!
Improving your batting average there sonny, good work.
and thus not being able to meditate. Which I found amusing.
I think you're wrong.
''I know it sounds like a plot from a bad hollywood movie''
That was me saying I know it's ridiculous, but part of my brain is susceptible to having thoughts like that.
James Lovelock, who has been the recipient of multiple prizes from the science community, including the volvo environment prize, wrote an entire book on a very similar principle.
I never said - I BELIEVE THIS IS WHAT IS HAPPENING. But if you let your imagination have an ounce of freedom it's not hard to create a narrative in your head based around events of the last 10 years.
i just lack imagination.
but if he talks about 'mother earth fighting back', then the man is a buffoon. as if the earth has some sort of 'spirit' or consciousness, that is.
"if he talks about 'mother earth fighting back', then the man is a buffoon. as if the earth has some sort of 'spirit' or consciousness, that is"
One doesn't necessarily equal the other. James Lovelock simply claimed that the world was a self regulating entity which is a phenomena that occurs artificially as well as naturally.
which is why i said i said 'if'., and continued to clarify my point.
If James Lovelock thinks earth has a consciousness he is a buffoon. But he doesn't...so, cool.
If I think the earth has a consciousness I am a buffoon. But I don't...so, cool.
Your contributions to this thread have been remarkable so far, strong work.
Mother Nature is plotting her next move?
This is exactly what she would want. We have to work TOGETHER.
i'd been in studying in a library for around 24 hours at that point.
it was clearly the EXTREME SUPER MOON
otherwise those poor bastards would be waking up to a tsunami warning this morning to wash down their two earthquakes.
6 miles below is actually not very deep for a quake, let alone one for this size...hope the damage is not too horrific. "Luckily" the Japanese are masters of designing buildings with quakes in mind
putting that many Nuclear power plants in that area.
Apparently they've shut them down? But imaging if they were seriously damaged and the compounding effect it would have on the disaster.
'Nuclear emergency' apparently. Those are two words you don't want used together.
i'm just going off a facebook post from someone in Japan. i'd think/hope these plants have been built with these things in mind
reading facebook updates from friends in tokyo, which have gone from quite jovial (as mentioned above, the buildings in tokyo are perfectly built to handle earthquakes, and a lot of people were unaware of what had happened outside of the city) to what they are now.
1139: norishikata tweets: "Gov't taking precautionary measures for Fukushima I nuclear power plant. No radioactive leakage. No need for residents nearby to evacuate."
that was the one in question. i guess rumours of the worst are going to spread in such a situation.
1237: Japanese authorities are urging some 2,000 residents living within a 2km radius of a nuclear plant in Fukushima to evacuate, the AFP reports. The plant has been shut down after its cooling system failed.
Fingers crossed for this.
this was essentially what my friend had written an hour ago. i know theres a news delay, but there never seemed to be any suggestion that residents shouldn't evacuate.
although if nothing has occured by now i guess things should be stable, barring an aftershock?
I got sent an email from someone in Christchurch this morning (they've only just got the internet back) with pictures taken of their house all in a mess and coming apart.
The Earth sucks.
but is there any chance this could set off Fuji/other volcanoes on the same ridge?
I think. Hopefully there wont be any more things happening.
Volcanoes are normally linked to subduction zones (also known as Convergent Boundaries), where one plate is denser and gets forced under the other one. The so called "ring of fire" around the pacific has a large number of active volcanoes (Pacific NW in USA, NZ, Indonesia, Phillipines), as well as the active volcanoes in Italy and Greece are examples of this
Earthquakes such as those recently in China, Iran and the famous San Andreas fault are caused by two plates effectively rubbing against each other whilst moving in opposite directions, known as Transform boundaries. These faults do not cause volcanic activity
Not erupted since 1700. But my understanding is that eruptions and earthquakes are unlikely to occur in quick succession. Obviously, shallow earthquakes near volcanoes are usually precursors to eruptions, but there is no evidence to suggest that this kind of techtonic earthquake is a indicator of an imminent volcanic event
Hollywood would never lie to us!
Still bollocks mind
I saw someone mention it on twitter but searching the news for 'hawaii earthquake' just brings up hundreds of the tsunami warnings
apparently, jsut a minor one as far as I can tell but I've not read an official news story on it - just saw on twitter
Hawaii is in the middle of a techtonic plate ( a different plate to the one involved in teh Japan quake) and any seismic activity would be linked to the volcanoes there. The geological activity in Hawaii is known as a "Hot Spot"
1146: The BBC's Greg Ward in New Zealand says authorities have downgraded the tsunami threat. They say there is now a marine threat only. This means strong and unusual currents are possible in the sea, river mouths and estuaries, but no land threat is expected, our correspondent says.
Some good news, I guess. Well not good, but not horrible.
More seriously, it's not the timing of any jokes, it's more the context. Slipping a gag into A N Other fred is perhaps a bit nore comedic than dredging an actual news-centric fred for quip potential.
which make me genuinely appreciate england and its geological stability.
hopefully the nuclear stations won't leak any radioactive material. poor japan :(
particularly considering that during the last earthquake we had all I could really feel was the stairs wobbling a bit.
it's like the really stupid people from other parts of the internet like youtube comments or something started posting with regulars' usernames.
Anyway yeah it's horrible obviously. The earthquake and tsunami that is.
Agree - we may moan about the weather, transport, petrol prices but quite frankly we are so lucky to live in this country. Democracy, geolocial stability and rain. The things that really matter.
and he/her family can't get hold of her.
its far too early to think anything has happened, as the networks are all busy or down, but still i can't imagine what they're going through.
to help get round the problem of networks being down. Don't know if it'd actually be helpful, though.
13:49 - "...the sea level has receded about 200ft, exposing reefs and rocks which are normally always covered."
the sea's going in and out now, maybe up to a 2m tidal surge, but relatively slowly compared to the 'big wave' alternative
Lots of warning, people moved to higher ground... should be OK
No, seriously, I'm not being flippant - the news this morning was going mental because Hawaii is part of the states and they had people on TV showing leaving the towns, and on the radio a mate of the monring DJ had just touched down for a wedding this morning to be told that he had to move in land and find shelter.
So it's pretty amazing... because I still feel like Japan is on the otherside of the world whereas it's actually connected to this country by an Ocean.
8.9 is fucking massive though. People who don't know this, but the Richter Scale is logarithmic. hence why 6.9 is much smaller than 8.9.
i fucking knew that, yet i didn't think. thanks.
in honolulu and everyone has been evacuated to higher ground. they are literally counting down the minutes until it hits now. :(
I fucking hope that's a typo.
i'm not sure how they've gotten an accurate tally across the whole affected area
just going off a beeb update.
and that affected about as populous an area, I'd guess.
Tsunami alerts around the rest of the ocean have mostly been lifted - think I heard the waves around Indonesia increased by 10cm.
fair play google.
that's basic fucking science, right there, chumps. fucking daily mail.
Next up in the DM: Supermoon increases risk of cancer
- Jeff, London, 11/3/2011 12:58
Hopefully the moon will affect the middle east by destroying it and bring peace to the world
- LJA, SKYE Scotland, 11/3/2011 14:19
Some of the worst comments are absolute gems.
All due to emptying the centre of this planet, and overweight of concrete cities, spiralling the planet out of control - CB, UK, 11/3/2011 No surprise you got red arrowed as people only see the ends of their noses but I have often wondered how we can keep dispalicing all that weight and liquid by taking oil out of the ground and it not have any effect on the gravity of the earth. So CB there are two idiots in the world.......or are we.
i heard there was 88,000 people missing. hundreds confirmed dead.
"Wave will hit 8am them crazy white boys gonna try to go surfing."
"Its all good Till b*tches see there christian louboutins floating down da street shit gone get crazy."
"Look this is very serious people I had to evacuate all my hoe's from LA,Hawaii and Japan. I had to do it. Lol"
"Look people are dying and all you can think about is my d*ck lol RT @_ChelseaHughes: @50cent have you still got the magic stick?"
Nuclear power stations exploding
and you're a cunt.
so the life loss is not as high as it could have been, but the economic cost is going to be huge, especially with the recent news of a nuclear power station exploding
or at least only a very conservative 'confirmed' toll
the Japenese defense force haven't even had a chance to land helicopters and rescue teams in the vast majority of the 6000 sq km that were inundated by the tsunami. Their eyes in the sky are reporting things like 'we see 300-500 bodies washed up in village x, 400-700 bodies in village y' etc.
Then there are still massive aftershocks - last one 15 minutes ago was a 6.1
these aftershocks are clearly hampering the rescue effort and each one is at least generating tsunami warnings if not actual waves
Fukushima has had a reactor container explode and authorities are stopping people entering a 65 km exclusion zone and have evacuated EVERYONE from a 10km radius
if there are survivors in the tsunami zone then they need rescuing fast, which doesn't look likely
added to that, there are 4 million Japanese homes without power and with HALF the country's transport infrastucture inoperable there are people stranded without adequate food or water
it ain't over yet and sadly the death toll and cost is set to be massive
this just tweeted by a Phillipines News Agency
"Japan confirms first ever nuclear meltdown after quake damaged Fukushima reactor. Evacuation expanded from 10-20 km radius."
It's gone Chernobyl
They're saying the reactor itself wasn't damaged. Unlike Chernobyl, the reactor had been shutdown long before this explosion. Hopefully this isn't as serious and as chilling as it forst sound.
Soviet engineering was the main reason Chernobyl could happen.
Modern nuclear reactors are hugely safer. So far it sounds no worse than Three Mile Island, thankfully.
"But I have been talking to a top British nuclear engineer who visited that plant in Japan and he says it was built in the 1970s and is not as earthquake-proof as later models."
A nuclear reactor built in a non-Soviet nation, even in the 1970s, would be far less likely to meltdown like Chernobyl. Sticking a nuclear reactor over a plate boundary, however, sort of throws all that other stuff out the window...
across three news items on The Register (link at the bottom of each news item.
I don't pretend to know as much about it as anyone on either side of the argument, except that I agree with those who've said now probably isn't the time to be having the debate about the inherent safety of nuclear reactors. There's certainly some enlightening stuff about the (theoretical) differences between these these reactors, Chernobyl and contemporary designs though.
however, it is 40 years old. There's still work to be done to contain this.
by some guy - I think his name was Brimstone - on the BBC this morning.
He said that yesterday's explosion wasn't a particularly significant event - in that it didn't release a lot of radioactive material and the buildings are designed to allow explosions like this to happen while leaving the frame of the building in place.
Even the most extreme scenario he described (the fuel melting through the bottom of reactor container thing) didn't result in significant amounts of radioactive material being spread over the surrounding area.
I dunno, it's weird how the Japanese Government are really playing down this series of events while TEPCO are, as far as I can see, being pretty straight and honest about what is occurring in their plant
there's also been lots of guff on the BBC about how nuclear is so safe - the science correspondent on the BBC yesterday said "Well actually, the most dangerous types of power station are hydropower because when a dam breaks the water can was away whole villages."
Seems some spin or PR is play somewhere
I think the Japanese govt does have some form with not being entirely honest about nuclear incidents. Even, TEPCO, apparently have been involved with/accused of coverups (I only just read this).
But I think the worst-case scenario (meltdown) would be a serious long-term, but local, environmental problem, rather than a Chernobyl-like quick spread of radioactive material over a large area. I imagine the evacuation is a precaution against venting of large amounts of steam, which would spread radiation (albeit short-lived) over the area in question.
I'm just trying to find specifics about this situation - between the slightly sensationalist reporting and the spin/PR.
Even if the risk of contamination of the surrounding area were in the region of 1*10^-10, that's still a risk that you don't want to take at this stage.
Again, I suggest reading through the comment threads on the stories I linked just above... if you can get past all the FUD on either side of the nuclear debate, there's some useful info about these specific reactors in there.
which probably means that nuclear facilities are better protected against this kind of eventuality than say an coal or gas fired power station, or indeed a hydroelectric dam. Because any potential catastrophe would be so much worse, the precautions and preventative action taken is so much higher etc.
That said, I'm extremely confused as to why the walls of the reactor exploded. No-one has properly explained why this happened or indeed why it shouldn't concern us.
rather the walls of the building that the reactor is housed in. Essentially the reactor core sits inside a reactor vessel, which sits inside a containment building, which sits inside the one that explodes. It's the outer layer of that lot that went.
My (possibly wrong) understanding from what I've read is that as part of mixture of gasses vented to release pressure would have been H2 (hydrogen gas) which is highly explosive with normal air. In other words it was a conventional explosion, not a nuclear one.
Apparently the containment building is still intact after that, which sounds like it's pretty key.
from the bbc
More from Japanese nuclear engineer Masashi Goto: He say that as the reactor uses mox (mixed oxide) fuel, the melting point is lower than that of conventional fuel. Should a meltdown and an explosion occur, he says, plutonium could be spread over an area up to twice as far as estimated for a conventional nuclear fuel explosion. The next 24 hours are critical, he says.
but it's also worth remembering that it doesn't seem there's anything to suggest that a core meltdown or explosion is any more likely to occur in the next 24 horus than it has been in the last couple of days.
1422: Japanese engineer Masashi Goto, who helped design the containment vessel for Fukushima's reactor core, says the design was not enough to withstand earthquakes or tsunamis and the plant's builders, Toshiba, knew this. More on Mr Goto's remarks to follow.
1426: Mr Goto says his greatest fear is that blasts at number 3 and number 1 reactors may have damaged the steel casing of the containment vessel designed to stop radioactive material escaping into the atmosphere. More to follow.
Several layers of protection have failed for various reasons, and if the fuel does meltdown then from what I've been reading it leaves the core at much, much greater risk.
I'm sure something's been missed in that BBC translation of Masashi Goto's comments though - the plant was designed for earthquakes and tsunamis, just not ones as powerful as struck (the earthquake was over 5 times more powerful than designed for and the tsunami was a little higher than the design allowed). Given that the event is outside design tolerances, credit to the engineers that the plant hasn't yet failed completely.
and there are already various international observers condemning the Japanese authorities for underplaying the risk
also, the wind has changed to a southerly
Tokyo is about 80km south south west
I REALLY, REALLY hope there has been no core exposure
but who knows?
World Nuclear News seems to be a good supply of info:
not sure what they mean by "serious damage to the reactor core". Broken fuel rods, maybe, rather than damage to the containment vessel.
a bit of a confusion from various news sources
the wind changed again now too
from what I was watching last night on NHK via CNN they seemed to be suggesting that it was 'very likely' that the suppression container had ruptured underneath the reactor core. I don't know what their source for this was.
Anyway, they measured 8,217 micro-sieverts per hour at the plant - which is a little over 3 times background radiation for one year - or in other word 26,200 times normal background radiation
also, they've had a fire in the spent fuel pods of reactor 4 as well
it's a massive catastrophe and there are going to be far reaching and, at this point, unknowable health effects
Exposure to 1,000 micro-seiverts causes male infertility
apparently it was measured at over 10,000 micro-seiverts per hour outside the main gates of the plant
that's over 30,000 times natural background radiation
interestingly it seems that this is almost entirely a result of a 3 hour fire in a spent fuel pod in reactor 4 - in other words a nuclear waste blaze rather than a reactor compromised
No-one knows that for sure either way yet.
It's a very worrying situation, but it doesn't help to be spreading unclear info (what with all the conflicting reports) and then finishing with FUD.
how do you even begin to rebuild/clean up after something like this?
which is being estimated at around 9.0 now, but the fact that we're seeing it happen to a developed country. We're almost used to seeing poor countries ripped apart by natural disasters, but seeing an entire modern country, with fleets of cars, modern houses, airports, roads being destroyed is actually terrifying. The pictures are unbelievable, it looks like the actual end of the world, apocalyptic fires and everything.
He's been given a get out of jail free card here... All the momentum and pressure has dissipated entirely, the focus has completely moved off him..
no, I don't think he is.
I just think it'd be pretty bleak to assume anyone - however awful - is rubbing their hands about this. Having read the Pearl Harbour comments I take that back.
so much as him saying exactly what he meant to say.
Sometimes you see stuff like this and when 100s of journalists are pointing the finger and asking 'what could be done differently?', you just have to remind yourself of how utterly cruel, amazing and above all powerful nature can be.
with my Japanese-Canadian friend. No idea it was this bad. It moved honshu 2.4m east. fucking hell.
i can't imagine what impact the radiation leak is going to have... just awful.
it was discussed on Newsnight last night actually if you want to check iplayer for a primer of the issues