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And I trust anything Aggers says
I blame ian bell.
It's a shame, but means the england can properly move on now and get a settled team together.
given how much he has played since the 2005 series.
Annoying he got injured playing in the sodding IPL though.
Mind you, it's not as if England aren't used to playing without him. We just need Stuart Broad to become that bowler he's threatening to become a little bit quicker now.
I'm not having the stats argument on him being ineffective. No one else has the ability to inspire like he does, maybe not with the bat anymore but definitely with the ball. Like when he had Kallis sh!tting it last year.
Hope he makes it through all this series. Best memory of him: in the ashes 05 when he was smashing the aussies all over the park and meant all the aussies were fielding on the boundary.
Some days I think he could be the new Glen McGrath, most days I just think STOP BOWLING THAT FLOATY LINE MILES OUTSIDE OF OFF STUMP.
his son, Stuart, on the other hand, now there's someone with potential!
It may be fair to say that he was a wasted talent, but I don't think he'll be remembered as such. In any case, I don't think you could say his talent was wasted, but perhaps he could done better than he did, but I'd put a lot of it down to injury.
They mean nothing.
Probably not. Is that his fault? Probably not. Missing over half of your countries test matches in an 11-year period a nd struggling with injury a lot isn't going to be conducive to hitting the top of your game.
Is he a wasted talent though? No. He reached a pretty incredible peak in '04-'05. It's just shame that it didn't last longer, so we'll not know whether that was his actual peak, or just a step on a ladder towards it.
And anyway, he's still got 5 years of one-day and T20 in him, which is where the world cups are, if we're measuring things in those ways.
and then deleted it because it was confusing the issue. there are a number of cricketing reasons relating to injury, the decline of the english team, and the nature of the role that flintoff plays in the team that have all contributed to his decline in recent years.. but none of this really matters.
just go on youtube, find that over to langer and ponting, and remember that flintoff was at key moments a herculaen cricketer who overcame his own weaknesses (mental, physical) to change games, series', and the way a country views a game.
the fact that he couldn't sustain this level of intensity doesn't mean that he didn't achieve his potential - on the days that really mattered he was a great as they came and i don't believe any cricketer of this generation has given more for the team.
You're making me well up...
he was a colossus in the series that mattered.
Goddamn, that over
I don't think he flattered to deceive, he was better than his figures show. The figures are good figures, though, for an all rounder, when combined together. Those figures are outweighed by a poor start to his test career, really. His golden period he averaged 40 with the bat for a two year period and 25 with the ball. Either of those would have been good enough to keep him in the team without the other.
He's still my favourite bowler to watch, purely because he seems to be throwing his entire frame into every ball in a way that looks detrimental to his health. He's also our best pace bowler for a while, despite the fact his statistics don't really back this up. Bamos has always said 'I have no truck with statistics' and I've often tried to argue against this but in Flintoff's case, it's true. His bowling average and at times his batting average, don't really do him justice as he's been the most likely England player in the last five years (maybe KP excepted) to change a game in one session.
And not just because he backs up my argument.
up until that home series against SA where he hit the awesome century and Paolo Ntini broke his bat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQRWxD_hASI), he had been kinda seen as a bit of a waster, overweight and everything, and his averages were about 19 & 48. Since then, it's been more like 36 with the bat and 29 with the ball, which is entirely comparable to Botham.
Also of note: he can carry four pints at once.
...he's one of a very few genuine all-rounders in the game today. Arguably he hasn't been more than a number 7 since his pomp, but in recent years who compares in test matches? Kallis certainly...Sean Pollock perhaps? Daniel Vettori (scored plenty of his runs against weak attacks) ? Andrew Symonds? No. Jayasuria? Dodgy ground, good a part time bowler though he was...
Flintoff is certainly deserving of a place in their company of the best all-rounders of the noughties...he's up there for sure.
I think, as in the last test match, our tail could be pretty decent in the next few years. Broad obviously knows how to hold a bat, but you'd be more comfortable to see him at 8 than 7, certainly no higher. Likewise Rashid but he's yet to play a test. Swann is obviously a decent number 8.
Clutching at straws a bit here...
"Waugh/Border's Australia for the two best teams ever" is how that should end
So much cricket is played nowadays that an all-rounder is far, far more likely to be injured, etc if they are a front-line bowler and a front-line batsman. Look at Jacob Oram - he has said he will have to choose tests or ODIs soon, and then there's Flintoff and Shane Watson.
Kallis survives so long because he is a support bowler now - he'll bat 4, and then be the fourth seamer. Vettori too: he is a bowler who can bat very very well, but bats at 8 or 9, not 6. Pollock was the same (and I believe Broad will follow that path - bowler who can really bat), and Symonds was never a front-line spinner in tests.
It is sad, but from now on I doubt many all-rounders - certainly not seam-bowling ones - will play test cricket; they'll be vital in ODIs, and I expect in T20s we will soon see two 'proper' bowlers and then Colly/Yuvraj clones, but we have seen the last of the Botham/Hadlee/Khan/Dev or the Flintoff/Kallis/Oram eras.
The game has moved on. As have attitudes. It seems that the fast bowling (genuine) all-rounder days have gone out with drinking before test matches.
Think you're right in that we'll see the all-rounders become closer to 70-30 people like Jayasuria and co. than 50-50 or even 60-40.
There was no way he should've capatained England in Aus