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inspired by the weezer thread (matt sharp).
then got even better a few albums later.
The rest doesn't really hold a candle to Piper at the Gates of Dawn for me
Piper is full of ridiculous 60s whimsy and stuff, from what I remember. I think the evolution would be there anyway, sort of like saying the Beatles never really topped Please Please Me. Again, I'm not saying no one's allowed to think that but it's not like either band churned out the same style all the way through their careers.
always thought moya and efrim get too much credit, Bryant is the key guitarist in that band (basing this on set fire to flames sounding more like Godspeed than asmz or hrsta)
are you saying it's shit too?
There's the Blue album and that's it.
Apart from singles like Hash Pipe and Beverley Hills, which are excellent, natch.
don't like those other blowks as much
I liked Emil Amos in Grails but he doesn't suit Om like Chris Hakius did
he was a bit like Bill Ward from the Black Sabbaths with his cyclical sort of style
especially the siren that's present all the way through 'Leave'. Up's got some good songs and I admire them trying to experiment with electronic stuff a bit more but don't really think they pulled it off. A lot of Up's songs were better live.
Their first record is my favourite and not even in an indie points way. Because, If Only.
so what are we saying?
I like the post bug albums but they weren't the same
I say that as if I was listening to dinosaur jr aged 9
Where You Been is still their best.
ylaom. It's a fact.
Suede - Bernard Butler
They've released one song without him (All The Rage Back Home) and it's a banger...
Just left before they started touring it.
and it's reasonable to say that they started going off after Antics (and were well off by the self-titled).
isn't him leaving the band.
50% of their recorded output isn't a matter of semantics. He played on all four albums, you didn't like the last two.
That has nothing to do with this thread.
They went shit before he left then.
the band but particularly his drug use escalated during the last two records and seem to have had a negative effect on their output, so I dunno, mentally he wasn't there any more
He definitely contributed a lot but they released some fantastic albums after he'd gone.
but I don't think any later albums have the 'completeness' of the first two
'Stranded' is better than roxys debut and is a hairs breadth away from being as good as 'For Your Pleasure' (their best album). Eno himself says 'stranded' is their best record. 'Country Life' is also great from start to finish.
He was certainly an important part of the original conception of the band, but he was not, as many people think, the only 'arty one'. Ferry was an art school graduate who studied under Pop-art pioneer Richard Hamilton and Andy Mackay had a performance art background. The idea that Roxy without Eno would just be some kind of bland lounge band is dead wrong.
Roxy did get gradually more mainstream as their career went on, but not immediately after Eno's departure. Their first five albums are all great, and Eno was only on the first two.
Also I don't think it works cos Arab Strap, Fold Your Hands and Storytelling are the worst Belle and Sebastian albums (Arab Strap obviously has some amazing songs on it, but the album itself is very mediocre) and they all feature Isobel and the first two feature Stuart D, but Waitress and Life Pursuit feature neither and are easily the best B&S albums after Tigermilk and Sinister.
probably coincidental, but...
Massive Attack's music has become more self-indulgent and certainly more 'white' since he left. When they were a trio they all seemed to keep each other's egos in check and he certainly saw himself as the main contributor, musically.
Everything up to and including Mezzanine is really great whilst everything since has been a bit like a watered down NIN.
Which is my favourite album of theirs, but you can hear the angsty rock and introverted stuff creeping in. Which is done really well on that album, just not after.
Also, after G temporarily left, they got worse, then slightly better when he came back.
Eh, Heligoland harked back to earlier MA, but I thought it was much worse than 100th Window, which was only an okay album.
It's amazing how 100th Window sounded much more like 1998 than Mezzanine did.
They've hardly recorded a memorable tune since he left.
House of Love went shit instantly.
and Mick Harvey
was initially quite a good thing as it was getting stale, but probably not great in the long run.
How the Bad Seeds haven't declined much despite losing such major figures as Blixa and Harvey. They have ups and downs but those are mainly attributable to the varying strength of Cave's songwriting. When he writes a good set of songs (as with the last album) the band are still unsurpassable (on record at least - Blixa is irreplaceable as a stage presence)
to the point where they've gone from being an obsession to making me cringe when I hear them.
And Tender Prey, The Good Son and Your Funeral, My Trial will always be my favourites.
Lyre of Orpheus/Abattoir Blues (no Blixa) is superb though, and so is Push The Sky Away (no Blixa or Mick). I think the change in the band is more down to Cave than to personnel changes in the band, who are still a superb group of musicians (you can't knock Barry Adamson, Conway Savage, Warren Ellis, Martyn Casey, Jim Sclavonus).
If you don't like them now I think it is more likely because you don't like the songs Cave writes now (which are very different from the ones he wrote when he was a drug crazed nihilist in his 20s) rather then because of who is in the band.
Could also be that Harvey/Bargeld had a significant input into the kind of songs Nick wrote when they were in the band - he's certainly displayed a lighter touch and a lot more humour since they left, but sadly those aren't the things I go to him for. I guess it's one of those relationships where the other person has changed, and I haven't...
When you realise you find an artist less interesting because they are less fucked up? I've been a bit like that with Cat Power. I had to stop myself hoping she suffered some personal trauma so she could make another great record.
At times I get quite irate that Nick is clean, happy & settled down with a good woman, when he should be wallowing in misery & squalor for my entertainment. Selfish cunt.
went downhill after "Stay Positive"
John Stanier (although I guess the rot set in before that)
latter day wilco is better wilco
All went a bit shoddy after Neil Busch left.
but I'm not sure they would have made another Arise or Chaos AD
Menomena - Brent Knopf
Justin and Danny might play a blinder on the next record.
but that last album is so so good.
Pique? Still put shivers down my spine
I thought 'Moms' was great. I miss Brent's voice and style, but it takes nothing away from the level of quality the other two produced. They've lost a dimension, rather than got 'worse'.
Hence my "arguably".
Snow Patrol (Mark)
Magazine - John McGeoch
PIL - Jah Wobble
Pulp - Russell Senior
Oasis - Tony McCarroll
Soon Over Babaluna was good, but their worst album up to that point. Everything after has its moments, but their albums generally got worse with each release.
Is an obvious one.
What about Crazy Beat?
They made worse albums than Think Tank with Graham.
Queens Of The Stone Age
Lou Reed sacking Cale was one of the greatest blunders in rock n roll history.
I think a better case could be made that Moe Tucker's absence on Loaded made for a worse album, even if she wasn't one of the songwriters.
but WL/WH is by far my favourite, and when I think of what another Reed/Cale dominated Velvets album might have been like, it makes me want to weep with disappointment.
Monomania sorely missed Josh Fauver imo
Still good live but the third album just didn't stand up