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When January's reached its end and you're not even listening to it anymore, I shall laugh. Oh yes, I shall.
but like top 3 or 10 or something?
Out of curiosity, how many times have you listened to it all? And did you listen to it knowing that you already wouldn't/couldn't like it?
but it's been out - what - three weeks? Even less when some publications stuck it at the tops of their lists. I don't understand how anyone could have listened to it enough times since its release, or even since it leaked, to be able to say "Yeah, this is the real deal - best album of the year". I guess it's somewhat superficial, but saying this is *the* best album of the year, or maybe even in the top 3, is making a real statement that can't yet - in my opinion - possibly have the evidence to back it up.
all these No. 1s in lists should be albums released before June? Or maybe September?
Yeah, that would be reasonable. Yeah. So Kanye missed the cut-off point by a month. Unlucky.
fairly good system, very logical and everything but the great thing about these lists is that they capture things that are current. Most peoples best of 2009 lists would have changed in some way now from what they were last year but it doesn't matter, we're not actually deciding the absolute best records, just facilitating discussions of exciting things as the last possible opportunity to bask in their newness before it passes.
quite a good deal of it has been floating around cyberspace for ever and a day.
These end of year lists always run into snags with this issue. Its kind of why I shy away from doing them (until later, maybe, sometimes), I'm still getting into a lot of the albums I got this year. Thats also the reason lists can be fun; to argue about this stuff and make outrageous claims. I said basically the same thing about that Das Racist album as you are saying about this, but only time will tell.
I've listened to the Kanye album about 10 times so far, and thats on the low end compared to other DiSer's.
Side note: I'm doing that rap thread from the 90's and I'm STILL indecisive about my picks, and thats 10-20 years removed and hundreds of listens later.
We're awesome. To clarify, I'm not saying people *will* have forgotten about MBDTF (are people calling it that?) by the time January's out. I mean, I am, but maybe I chose my word's badly. I didn't mean to make any judgement on the album's quality. I'm just saying people should be patient, you know? And I wonder, in this specific case, how much of it's a triumph for hype over substance. What would have happened if it hadn't been Kanye? Not if it hadn't had his voice or his production on it, but just his *name*? Or if Pitchfork hadn't given it a perfect 10? Although I'd argue even that was a product of the Kanye brand rather than a contributor towards it. So yeah. Maybe it'll go down as one of the all-time great albums. Who knows.
say that album/band/musician X will be forgotten in 5 years/1 year/next week etc - can I have your psychic powers? Otherwise, bog off.
*assumes confrontational cowboy posture*
there'd be more of a consensus on it being album of the year
in the same way you could say:
"FAO everyone who's put The Suburbs at the top of their end of year list
I'll be laughing at you when you rate it differently relative to other 2010 albums in 2020!"
The lists are what people's favourite albums of the year are now. Of course this will change over time - but, alternatively, MBDTF might grow in stature, and people who didn't put it as number 1 could later wish they did.
* although anyone who does put The Suburbs as #1 is, of course, way off the mark
It's a good point. Why's everyone being so precious? Jeez.
that within a month or so they'll probably forget about the album they really like now - people have this funny habit of not liking stuff like that.
so it's not really that great of a point.
You enjoying albums? Sorry Lou, this isn't personal. I don't want to get personal. But when people put these lists together - and publications especially, which is really who this thread is aimed at - I think they aim to give them some lasting value. And what lasting value can you give to a judgement on an album that was only released a couple of weeks ago? What's the difference between this and saying "FUCK GUYS, THIS IS THE BEST ALBUM EVER!" as soon as you've finished your first listen through? Why should anyone listen to you? It doesn't mean anything.
This is business, not personal. It's strictly business, and this man is taking it very very personally.
so probably not.
He has a knack for writing tunes, even if he isn't a great lyricist.
the guest appearances just make you think "hey, imagine if Kanye West was mute"
great. lets list artists who aren't great vocalists that make brilliant music. there are loads of them.
and he is a fucking good rapper (if not singer) not many others can chuck out that variety of beats and flow all fucking over them.
You can hear the RZA's stamp all over Dark Fantasy, and NO I.D. all over a few other tracks.
There is one track on the album that Kanye doesn't have production credits for - Devil in a New Dress, which was produced by Bink!. Notably, it stands out from the rest of the crowd for having a more 'traditional' hip hop sound than any other track on the album.
Kanye has been well documented as being a perfectionist in the studio constantly tweaking things... but I assume he listens to other producers beats and uses his favourites as templates. All of the Lights and Monster are rare Kanye tracks in the sense that they have little in the way of samples or co-production.
i love reading articles about kanye in the studio, sounds intense
but didn't really get what all the fuss was about
but I don't get all the hyperbole. Each to their own and all that, though.
Which is why it's quite high on my list.
Message boards are a strange place sometimes.
It's probably in that big thread somewhere, but I cba.
That's what I decided a while ago, anyway, and I can't really be bothered to think about it any more.
I was thinking earlier that the Women album does for indie rock what the Kanye album does for hip hop - it stays completely grounded in it's genre, while managing to push said genre into new places, quietly (or less quietly in Kanye's case) leaving the rest of the competition behind.
While the Women album has been far less publicised, they are probably my 2 favourite releases of the year.
It hasn't got nearly enough recognition this Listmas.
why don't you like Kanye?
I've not heard the new one. In fact, I've never heard a Kanye album. Cue a load of "omg, you should listen to College Dropout" and that, but I haven't. My knowledge of him breaks down to:
That one that used Move On Up, but wasn't as good as Move On Up. It was alright though.
That one that used Daft Punk, and absolutely butchered it. Horrendous.
Golddigger, which was pretty good, especially on the dancefloor, but has never persuaded me to get it. I've got a mashup of it with Walter Murphy & Beethoven's 5th though; that's good.
Probably some other singles and stuff. Think I heard one or two of the leaked tracks off this album when they went up on youtube. They were alright too.
I might check out the new one at some point, but I've got a long list...
You would probably like the not so obvious cuts a little bit more. Pm me your address and I'll send you a cd.
One thing I've noticed with Kanye West, for me, is that I like his songs for about a day and then I hate them after that.
I got the new one (the only one I've heard) last week, rinsed it, and now am a bit sick of it.
i put burial's untrue at the top of my list without hesitation (it came out in november, i believe). this resulted in much scoffing from my mates, who believed that anything other than in rainbows as album of the year was ridiculous (i may have even gone with the twilight sad had burial not blown my mind, but i digress). the kanye was/is even more immediately recognizable as a truly landmark album and it deserves the accolades. sure, i may be listening to other stuff more (destroyer, james blake) in january but it doesn't mean kanye doesn't deserve the 2010 title.
No matter how great they are and P4K/year-end list love they get they're really quite disposable.
ooh, a fair amount of them.
My favourite album of 2009 at the time was Solillaquists of Sound, and a year on it still is both my favourite and probably most-listened-to (with competition for the latter mostly coming from 2 other hip-hop records on the form of Myka 9 & Anti-Pop Consortium).
By far my favourite album this year is Dessa and, although it may well be knocked down a few spaces by virtue of there being a LOT I've not heard yet, I reckon I'll still be listening this time next year. Impossible to tell, of course...
I like some hip-hop, though. The guy we're talking about. Nas, El-P, Aesop Rock, ATCQ, Wale, Lil B, Lil Wayne, token Brit stuff, Kid Cudi. I just find it very ATM and find that once I hear an album a few times I don't recognize anything new to me that I didn't notice before like I would with other genres.
I don't know what to tell you if you can't enjoy some of those names repeatedly.
I usually just soak in the general vibe first, and then after more listens, the nuances of the production come forward. The lyrics are usually one of the last things I really focus on unless they are extremely cringeworthy or extremely complex.
Rock can be just as disposable or singles heavy as rap. I think theres been a few releases this year that focus more on the overall cohesion of a full lp. Kanyes album being one of those.
J/K, cheers. Good advice, that. It annoys me when I can't fully get into genres I the least bit like. I also quite enjoyed 808's and Heartbreak, the new one is always tempting me at my local Tesco equivalent. Maybe I'll pick it up my next visit, minus indie points and all.
Also... screw indie points, you need up your swag bucks.
And anything J Dilla touched, obvs
I know this because the Avalanches are the only hip-hop band I give two shits about. So Zapsta's wins the argument.
^ indie bedwetter of the day.
bandz r much better than hippity hop
LOL @ The Avalanches being called hip-hop
i've liked him plenty over the years but i liked him best when he sounded pissed off and pared down and miserable on the last album.
about 15 times all the way through, 3 times in a row when i was stuck in a car during the snow
that doesnt count the number of times i have listened to my fave tracks off it at the gym or just for a boogy in me room
i will be listening to it for some time to come
mostly because I'm desperate to get as excited about this album as everything else. but what is it that he does on this album thats so inventive? yes, the production is very "maximal" but I'd actually contend that a record like, say, "Stankonia" had a great deal more depth and size to the production, (not to mention better rapping both technically and lyrically) and that came out 10 years ago.
its definitely a good album, I do like it. I just honestly don't hear a classic.
the pitchfork write up for it as best album of the year sums up the problem for me. the album itself isn't even mentioned until the last sentence, and even then no reference is made to its style or even quality
so that a whole new write up isn't yet necessary. Just a guess mind.
I don't understand all the fuss about this album too but the point's still valid if their was any other number 1.