Your are viewing a read-only archive of the old DiS boards. Please hit the Community button above to engage with the DiS !
STATE YOUR PREFERENCE
Final epic song....couldn't agree more. Kinda gives it that extra element any great album should have, the final epic song that more often then not is only fully appreciated with longevity.
Epic song first, unless the whole album's epic, is kinda boring (dare I say it, Yo La Tengo's last effort would have been better without the first track)
It's not the last track.
well it should be to be in keeping with my point.
start with, and end with a bang.
but the latter if i had to choose
like Lifted by Bright Eyes. YEAH.
YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE
but it depends on what surrounds it. A 6 minute track might be labelled as long and epic if every other song is a 2 minute blast
I always find it a bit obvious & lazy when bands finish their album with a big epic slow one. End with a fast one! "Heart & Soul" by BRMC is a good example
who end A Ghost Is Born by having a really long, droning track and then the biggest pop choon on the album. oh jeff tweedy, you cad.
"obvious and lazy" might be a bit strong, but its definitely a lot easier to end an album serenely than with a bang
"obvious and lazy" is probably about right
The 'obvious' album closer on their album is 2nd last, and the last one is a reet stomper...
'Deathface' - Some Girls
best of both worlds.
The long epic track is in the middle.
Anyways I always like short punk openers and long post-rockish endings.
Ride - Going Blank Again
Both Stone Roses
Pink Floyd - Wish you were here
Start with a long one = me being bored to tears and skipping it or turning it off.
Ending with a long one = the conclusion of the alub-shaped journey.
It bums people out, which can only be a good thing.
Led Zeppelin - Presence
just thinking about it the end of pink is fucking epic too..
of starting with an epic song. But if it's at the start, it's got to be a good one.
If you can't write something epic that's good enough to kick off your record, you probably shouldn't bother.
I think it's good to start with something that's short and to the point.
beginning an album with a really long tune is a good idea. This Is Your Captain Speaking decided to chuck a 19 minuter at the beginning of their debut and just look at well it did them.
Chuck 'em at the end a la Fear Satan and there are no obvious problems.
Broken Chairs from Keep It Like A Secret by Built To Spill is a great example.
'Jimi' on Hairway to Steven by the Butthole Surfers
sorry, better luck next time
to all the people who sided with "start": Well done! Have a gold star
'Pink' - Boris with it's 18-minute end track.
'The Ugly Organ' - Cursive
Spiritualized - Cop shoot cop
with 'Pass the Hatchet, I Think I'm Goodkind' is pretty amazing. I usually prefer shorter tracks when I'm listening to new bands though, as I tend to get bored quite easily.
here's some qualification
I'm pretty patient when it comes to music. But if you've sat through the rest of the album and then an epic closing track comes on.. i sometimes start to feel a bit of fatigue. And on further listening i might start to dread the closer, perhaps thinking "i like this album but christ, do i really have to listen to that?" Especially if there's no variation in the epicness, or no sort of "payoff" - i'm just far more discerning of any wasted time when it gets to that point
On the other hand, i'm far more patient the other way round. If you stick an epic track at the beginning my senses are still fresh and my resolve still sharp. My appreciation of time is slightly fuzzy, so a ten minute track will seem a lot shorter, and any subsequent tracks tend to appear brisker and more focussed. As well as this, the nature of epic tracks often demand an ethereal or ambient quality. Having such drawn out passages followed by a more immediate numbers.. the contrast makes either side better, innit
All this might just be me though. And personally, i prefer Maggot Brain and DJed to Sister Ray and The Diamond Sea
Sometimes, especially if the whole album is long itself, a lengthy last song can be quite off putting. Someone above mentioned Spiritualized's Cop Shoot Cop but for me that song is the perfect example of what I mean. 'Ladies and Gentlemen...' is so long that by the time Cop is half way through I'm done with it. I really love that album but I don't always manage to listen to it all the way through.
Also, I don't think that listening on CD helps albums that finish with an epic long track. If you have to get up and turn over the vinyl it gives you time to pause and obviously provides a break between the music. You don't get that time to stop and think with a CD and I feel it lessens the impact of having a really long ending to an album.
i suppose you could say the 20 minute long starting/ending track is a relic of the vinyl age (now primarily used by those hoping to reproduce or pay homage to that era). I certainly think the idea of pausing for thought before such a song is a powerful notion
and re: Ladies and Gents - couldn't agree more. I really enjoy Cop Shoot Cop on its own, but attached to the rest of the album it just seems a step too far. Although i do normally hold out and listen to it all
so the start, I guess.