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do you think they'll actually do anything/get anywhere?
They'll say 'some of this is bad, but we can't stop people who genuinely can't go to a gig that they bought tickets for'. And that will be it.
Touting will contine. For-fucking-ever.
What I don't get is why they don't just let people who genuinely can't go return their tickets.
It'd solve at least some of the problems.
It would make promoters take less risks on artists they'd put on, I reckon.
They will try to get an agreement from venues/ promoters /ebay etc to try to prevent multiple applications for tickets from touts.
But I think that technology will shortly stamp all this out. You will not get a physical ticket, but just present the card that you bought the ticket with at the venue.
i care far more about ticket agencies charging me £5 admin fee and £1.50 postage on an £11 ticket, as might have happened if i'd got one for The National through See Tickets. That's 50% of the ticket price extra. Luckily, the portsmouth promoters also sell them through the wedgewood room website for £12.50 delivered.
were charging £10.50 booking fee.
how can they justify that eh?
the top half hard left, and the bottom half hard right.
But here's a poseur: as well as a booking fee, are ticket agencies allowed to charge above the official face value price? only the other day i got a ticket for Interpol for the official FV price of £20, then found out a friend wanted to go too, so i decided to get him a ticket but from a different site. They were charging £23 - before the BF. How come?
source of annoyance. You think 'Yeah, I can afford £11 to see them, or whatever' and then by the time you've hit the checkout, it's £17.50 and delivered by some clown in a Ford Cortina at 3am, and if you miss him then you've got more chance of skiing across Morocco than getting your ticket without wasting another £4 on phone calls.
like it is in France.
It won't stop touting, but it'll stop every schoolboy with broadband to stop it as e-bay... wouldn't be allowed to allow the tickets to be sold on their website.
that young people can be cunts too?
you, sir, are a cunt. not you jamie.
jacques le cunt!
i shit on your face thrice fold, mr legend. you have a monkey cunt for a face. enjoy your dog's cock of a life while i vomit on your mother.
since ebay became so widespread any selfish fucker with blurry moral values can buy more tickets than they need and sell the rest at their own profit.
Making it illegal wouldn't stop everyone, and there are of course genuine reasons why a person might sell on a ticket (though that could be aided by allowing the return of tickets to the seller, at least occasionally). But banning it would cut down the entrepreneurial attempts of various utter bastards
an important parallel economy with many people making money ( and even a living ) without the state receiving taxes, it's worthy of state intervention !
will make impossible for normal people to get tickets at normal price.
Would you find normal if people bought all the toothpaste in the UK to sell it back 10x the price ?
the freedom of the MANY people that would'nt be allowed to buy tickets because of touts, is more important than the freedom of the FEW people who want to make money on those people...
Sometimes state regulation is necessary and perhaps this is one of those cases.
if some companies manage to buy every ticket for a gig, no one will be able to produce other tickets...
we support all the legislation in this country! half of the laws i've broken i do not support, to be honest. and the other's i've probably broken unknowlingly.
better solution: don't make touting illegal. just make it LEGAL to punch them in the face.
Shouldn't it be made compulsory?
you really think that? please, i'd love to meet you. come to london on my birthday june 17th. i'm going to see aela.
basically, i'm asking you to make my day.
but I'd have said it to your face for sure.
Why wouldn't I?
That explains how childish that last post was.
still punch him?
for a laugh?
THATS A THREAT!!!!111*
*this references a threat made in an earlier post by this tout.
Plus he's only 15. And smaller than me, probably.
But I don't really get the "you're too scared to say it to my face" thing. It just makes him sound a bit silly.
yeah. i guess he's probably small and weak. you're right, 'n that.
but I'm about 14 stone so the odds are he's likely to be smaller than me.
people who make threats over the internet (which btw includes "I bet you wouldn't say that to my face"-style posts) are just plain ridiculous.
"And if you lot don't want to make money by doing this, your bonkers.
Imagine, half of you could probably have commited crimes in your life and taken advantage of others, so why dont the other half of you do it back to them, take advantage LEGALLY. "
If half of the tickets ( or even more ) are bought by touts, it makes it impossible for other people to buy them.
The problem isn't that there's idiots ready to pay a lot for some tickets ( if they're stupid enough... ), but that, by buying hundreds of tickets, touts are basically making it impossible to some people to have tickets.
So it's WRONG ! You can try to convince yourself otherwise but it is.
Freedom of making business. Yes.
Denying some people freedom to buy what they want. NO !
Brick Wall: "..."
in any way qualifies as "the government overstepping its role".
Of course you need regulation.
it's not like the government spends all of its time more wisely.
the price than the band, promoter and everyone involved in the gig found right.
Would you really find it normal if the same thing happened to another product which quantities are restricted ?
To barge in on the above argument... it seems that the ticket agencies, promoters, venues etc don't have much power to stop touts right? In effect, legally, what can these organisations do to stop touts??? Not very much I suspect
Now, if the government made it illegal to tout, then the ticket agencies, promoters, venues etc would have the law on their side and could take more effective action to prevent touting right?
Therefore, I have no problem with the government being involved if it gives organisatoins more power to stop touting.
If it ends touting, surely it's not a bad thing?!
Also - touting is actually extremely agressive. I was with a friend of mine outside a gig once and he had a spare ticket which he wanted to sell to a fellow fan at face value. The local touts behaved exyremely agressively towards him and literally threatened him with violence if he didn't sell the ticket to them! This is completely unacceptable. If someone is willing to buy a ticket from a tout at a hideously inflated price, then more fool them... but agressive tout behabiour is absoultely unacceptable and anything (within reason) that will help end it is fine with me, government action or not.
The elected Government, who spend the public's money, serve the public - the public are effectively their 'employers' (although this is often very hard to believe!).
Therefore, to me, the Government should be involved in anything that is a public issue? Such as touting. Yes?
All of this is of course, just my opinion.
Can you explain why you feel this way a bit more?
I don't really understand why you feel this way...
but frankly the idea that the government shouldn't regulate the marketplace is one favoured by big businesses who don't want to be regulated 'cos it'd mean they can't get away with the ethically questionable things they do to make money.
I think it should be the duty of the state to put measures into place to prevent exploitation of its citizens by people only out for their personal profit.
At the same time I respect that you take a different view to me and I'd rather not get into an argument about this 'cos we're not gonna reahch a consensus.
I just wanted to point out that your view that the government should not regulate the marketplace certainly isn't the only perspective. I for one would be happy for the state to take a role in regulating business transactions of this nature.
I can understand what you're saying here - and I can agree with you that it'd be madness for there to be legislation that deals with controlling the price at which all 2nd hand goods are sold. So, I can agree with you on the fundamental "free market" type argument... that free citizens should be able to sell things at any price they want to if there are people willing to pay for these things. I absolutely see your point with this and agree iwth that - this is why I have no sympathy for people who buy from touts.
Also, I'm not suggesting that the Government should control the market, just that it might be helpful for the public at large if the Government helped promoters and venues to stop touting by giving them more power to do so.
I'm not asking for the Government to control the situation, I'm asking the Government to give more power to those that should.
To go off on a bit of a tangent, it's like the 'fair trade' thing - the 'free market' is absolutely flawed because those with the power can control the market. European farmers who are subsidised by their Governments can sell their produce at lower prices than third world gorwers who don't have such subsidies. The third world growers simply can't compete. "That's life in the free market" is what you might say. But for me, responsibilities for your fellow man are more important. Although it's all a "free market", is it right that the little guy is crushed? I suppose the parallel I'm drawing is that in both of these situations "Free trade" doesn't equal "fair trade".
Maybe I'm too much of a socialist and think that the Government should look after the people first and business 2nd... Don't get me wrong though, I can see where you're coming from though Vikram. Sorry for going off on a tangent!
like theguywithnousername said - we just see things from different perspectives, which is a good thing.
I guess there are many different schools of thought on this, and no absolutes. None of us are "right" or "wrong" - we probably agree on a lot of things (like touting is wrong!).
Good to air our views though.
time to go now...
are you against the whole 'fair trade' movement etc and if so, why... do you think there it should just be a free-for-all and that it's OK that western subsidisation affects 3rd world producers etc...?
but yes, another time....
there's a big difference between NEW products ( including gigs or sport tickets ) that are supposed to be paid at the price the people who are selling it, want to sell it and OLD products ( including antiques ) that can be paid at the price consumers are willing to pay.
So basically :
someone want to pay 300 £ for an old Arctic monkeys ticket to brag that he was there ? OK !
Someone is selling 300 £ for a new Arctic Monkeys ticket he rushed to buy before anyone else with the sole intention to re-selling it ? NO !
I think this idea of not issuing physical tickets might be a good way to get around touts a little... if the purchaser has to present their booking number and credit card with which they purchased the ticket on the door, and no physical ticket is issued in advance, it's difficult for touts to have a 'product' to sell...
However, this makes buying tickets difficult for those without a credit card or debit card...
but anyway, just something I observed the last few times I've been to a show that runs in this way and a tout asked me if I had any spares.
I really hate touts.
people knew what touting was before you started doing it.
he truly IS legend!