FAQs: Can I intern for DiS? Can I write for DiS? (Part 1)

This is brilliant - thank you so much for that. It's really refreshing to have clear guidance of what to do to obtain an internship.

I will start blogging...NOW!

I want a job too

tis actually the english way with a zed

i meant to queue it and read it back, rather than set it live and had changed the phrasing as it needed 'em before.

however, we're looking for people who can express themselves and the odd bit of spag can be sorted out by eagle-eyed subs.

promptly follow's gibbard's advice.

DIS has fired all of its great staff and now needs you to come and work for them for free and be happy about it.

(i feel its only a matter of time before i get banned from this site)

Even transport costs?

and we do pay for some contributions and will continue to use some ad money to do so.

thx xxxx

That some form of free tickets for gigs that you want reviewing can be organised?

but when 'writers' got paid and got comfortable they, for the most part, got lazy and boring and fat.

lead onto jobs which do.

my comment was in response to bigbadboy NOT to moderaterock

so ill just not pay my bills and tell them its because im doing a job im not getting paid for and im sure they'll say... oh ok, we'll just wait for you to pay yours bills until you get that well paid job an internship always leads to... not a problem'

you should pay to be allowed to write with mistakes like that

also,
http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/07/20/104-unpaid-internships/

an internship just isn't for you

couldn't be much more wrong

"if youngsters are intent on music journalism they ought to set up their own website" - what, and join the blaring cacophony of blogs all with Something Very Important To Say? DiS' name and reputation is invaluable and I know how many doors it's opened for contributers - speaking personally and for other people.

"exploitation" - is a hugely Daily Mail word. Was I being exploited when I was able to go to pretty much any gig I wanted for free, or get packages and packages of CDs before their release date for free, or being able to sit down with artists I love and respect and talk to them about their music? The idea that somehow because I wasn't being paid means what i produced invalid is ludicrous. The reward and results were the same I love writing not only because it's basically the only thing I've been able to do, but because music means so much to me in my life. And moreover, I was able to get my work read by tens of thousands of people every day - would that have been possible if I was writing on dogshitmusic.blogger.blogs.com? Hell no.

The majority of contributors have always worked for free at DiS because they enjoy doing it. It's that enthusiasm that fuelled the site, and the fact that Kev/Al/Sam/Mike were salaried so they could afford to spend hours every day bleeding their eternal love for music into internet format. Also, every single journalist I've ever met said they did a whole load of unpaid work experience - some useful and some not so useful - but it's incredibly important to learn your craft. Without spending so long working for free and without the pressures of having to turn copy round I'd never have developed my own writing style and I'm sure it's the same for everyone else in that position. Of course, it's important not to be taken advantage of but all that requires is simple common sense: DiS is prestigious and bestows this prestige on its contributors.

phew.

He's right, you know.

i have no idea where you get these 'facts' from.

more than one writer/contributor at dis has always been paid and we still continue to pay for some contributions. but when we're talking about a few days or maybe a couple of weeks of peoples time, it's because it's an experience. they're not 'taking our jobs', it's an entry level position at a company which has very little money.

i want people to do things because they want to do it, writing because they need to do it, not because they're getting paid (although, people do get paid and get trips away, entry into pretty much any gig they want, get exposed to a lot of music, etc).

dis ran for 6 years before it even got close to covering the rent on my studio flat and only then it was because of doing it for all that time working 3-6 other jobs.

anyone who doesn't get this, isn't going to apply.

I'm the fool? Cock off, child.

Writing, just as with any kind of creativity, is a craft that needs to be learned. Plumbers take on apprentices who earn a pittance; writers work for free to develop their own style and voice. This is by no means the only industry that operates along these lines and, what's more, it isn't going to change any time soon. As I said before there is the opportunity for writers to be exploited (especially young, naive ones) but there is even more opportunity for writers to flourish, in whatever fashion.

"the music world is notorious for people being exploited" - yeah, usually the dumb fucks buying the music. It has a reputation for people being exploited, yeah, but people either side of the journalistic line make plenty cash to be able to survive. Your entire argument seems to hinge on the idea that by working for free/not-much-cash that people are handicappling themselves and the industry. You forget that to work in the music industry is a total fucking privilege and one that is by no means a 'real job'. My house mates wake up at 6am, go to work, be miserable at work and then come home miserable because they spent 9 hours doing something that doesn't turn them on. I get to go to work, love what I do and come home with fewer pounds but more love in my heart. And that's handicapping the industry? No fucking way. I work in this world because I love and adore it.

But what world do you live in, where this endless conveyor belt of "groups of 18 year olds" come along and replace all us mid-20s hacks like Menudo but without the blowjobs? All that assumption foes is paint the picture of a world where considered opinion is worth less than blind youthful exuberance - the world where each human being owns a blog but no one reads each other's. Great. A society of sollipsistic ramblings designed to promote every single possible point of view without considering why critics get in the position they do, why they're able to eke out a living by talking about music, or film, or art, or television.

Another assumption you're labouring under is that music criticism/journalism/PR is, in fact, a real job. It's not. It's a fucking hoot. The idea of being paid a few quid is laughable, let alone a yearly salary. Jesus fuck, it's people rabbiting about pop music! And you somehow expect that to be worth anything? You think that art critics fulfill some vital role in the furthering of human society? Hell no. We exist because we exist; it is purely cyclical. Some DIY labels make zero cash and yet manage to put out some of the finest music known to humanity - but are they ENTITLED to remuneration? No. They deserve it, arguably, but the idea that art should correspond to money is a spurious claim. And if the artists can't make money because fucking idiotic kids "download the Foals torrent the next day" or however you put it, then the critics shouldn't either.

You might've realised that the problem lies not with the industry - even though it is duty bound to attempt to find solutions - but with the broadband-enabled, over-privileged middle-class kids who believe that because they have the capacity to download that means they are entitled to. Music is being devalued, but by the consumer. The culture of convenience means that lazy people get fat on whatever they can get for free - and music journalists aren't going to get paid until fucking cunts stop justifying to themselves why they aren't going to pay for the Foals album and cough up their fucking cash instead of buying another flatscreen TV.

Oh, and you "can reasonably assume I make next to no money"? Get fucked you pretentious cocksnaffler. I earn enough to pay my rent in London, eat, live and purchase how I want, and there's enough left over to buy all the Springsteen albums I don't own. So there goes your theory. And this is burning away my self respect? Not a chance.

defender of the faith. you go girl! etc

Very well said.

Although the middle-class element seems a bit redundant, the comment about over-privileged kids thinking that the capacity to download entitles them to free music is a great one.

for a friend of mine who isn't on the board (yet). His question is:

"Would you be in the DIS office 9-5, and therefore expected to somehow live in London on no wage, or can it be done by proxy"

If it is a full time thing, with only some expenses, then I can't see how someone not from London can apply, unless they have mega bucks.

http://fromsinking.wordpress.com/2008/09/05/on-the-pros-and-cons-of-internship/

Basically: if you are in London/can reach it cheaply enough AND have financial support of some kind to cover the duration of any internship (i.e. you are not losing your own money), I recommend signing up.

If you're out of uni with debts, have just moved to London and want to boost the CV, get a paid job first and build the body of your writing work over time, asking places like DiS (and other sites/zines like Angry Ape, Rocklouder, Rockfeedback, Gigwise, Contactmusic, Artrocker, etc) if there are writing opportunities.

Two very different sides to doing unpaid intern work. It can be a benefit, but rarely - all depends on the mindset of the individual taking it on.

when I started photographing for DiS (and various other things) I was working full time as a receptionist... You can still build up a good body of work whilst working 9-5 paying the bills (if like me you can't afford to work for free, or just expenses).

Colchester name drop.

That's all I have to say at the moment.

with interns all week. I reckon you can probably expect to work in the music industry for a minimum of one year temping or working for free, before some kind of paid regular work comes your way (unless of course, you're lucky or your dad works at Universal). Many music companies that do interning won't even cover your expenses. One place I intern'd at a few years back said they'd only pay 75% of my expenses because I lived out of London at the time. I lasted a month and £400 out of pocket.

With writing work, you're looking at building up a portfolio probably for a couple of years before any of the national mags will look at your work. Even then, they'll probably ignore the 100s of emails you send them. And you'll probably get offered something when someone you met once at a gig name drops you.

I think DiS is actually being nice about paying expenses and offering aspiring writers this opportunity. A year ago, this wasn't the case. My advice is to get as much experience as you can whilst you're in university, interning and working for free then (if you can afford it). It will save you a couple of years out of university.

Or get a job that's not in the music industry. You'll be a lot less poor. :)